Were people in the Old Testament saved differently than we are today? Kimberly and John probe this question that sounds academic but really isn’t—because if salvation ever worked one way for God’s people back then and another way for us now, that says something troubling about God Himself. He doesn’t change; He doesn’t change the rules on His own people. He never has.
So these questions are explored carefully: Who God is and what the law was really there to do. How were Abraham and Job saved? What of Simeon and Anna in the temple at the birth of Jesus? They all reveal: Salvation has always come by grace through faith in Christ, never by works of the law. And this is not just a nice theological footnote. Any gospel that sneaks works back in—baptism, confession, rule-keeping to stay saved—isn’t a minor error. It’s a lie that can cost those we love—everything for eternity.
Key Takeaways:
Jacob Paul: Welcome to the truth and love podcast with your hosts Kimberly Faith and John Mack. The truth and love podcast seeks to present God’s timeless truth through the lens of his remarkable love.
Kimberly Faith: That today’s podcast is something we have talked about before. But you know, the more I teach, and talk with people who have been Christians for a long time, the more that I see that this is really a, just a fundamental flaw in I don’t know if it’s discipleship or the church’s teaching or people just aren’t understanding or maybe people don’t know how to teach it, but it’s that people in the Old Testament were saved the same way as the New Testament. And in fact, the title of this podcast, the gospel wasn’t hidden in the Old Testament, I think speaks directly to that.
John McLarty: Yeah. And that’s really it’s a great topic and that the idea is is not only not hidden, it’s it’s abundantly clear when you dig into the Old Testament that salvation has always been the same.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. And and let’s just give everybody kind of a map of where we’re going today. We’re gonna start with the first part of this is who God is. Because that’s the foundation for this truth that the gospel has always been the same. And then we’re gonna look at what the law was for.
Mhmm. We’re gonna meet Abraham. We’re gonna go to Job. We’re gonna stand in the temple with the two people who had been waiting their whole lives for the promise, and then we’re gonna bring it all home. Perfect.
Yeah. And so let’s let’s kinda start with I think I think you brought this up in our earlier discussions this morning, kind of our front porch discussions. And Revelations thirteen eight, which kind of is a bellwether verse for this.
John McLarty: It is.
Kimberly Faith: Do you have that or I’m gonna read it?
John McLarty: You go ahead. Okay.
Kimberly Faith: And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him whose names are not written in the book of life of the lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
John McLarty: That phrase right there, the lamb, which is Jesus Christ slain from the foundation of the world, that means even though there was a point in time, the cross, the lamb slain, the crucifixion of Jesus Christ, but in the mind of God, that was done before the foundation of the world, which means it was a done deal.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. So the bluff, the bottom line is to the question, has there ever been more than one way of salvation? The answer is in Revelations. The answer is no. Because if there had been more than one way, then why does the Bible say that Jesus was basically crucified, from the foundation of the world?
John McLarty: And then as we’re about to do, we tie this into God’s nature. And, I kind of have a famous quote from one of our associate pastors, Kenny Francis, Everything is the way it is because God is the way He is.
Kimberly Faith: I love that.
John McLarty: And God hasn’t changed.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right.
John McLarty: We’re going to dig into that in a little bit, but that’s kind of what we’re saying is that salvation is always the same because it’s based on God’s nature, and God’s nature hasn’t changed.
Kimberly Faith: Right. And so, yeah, that’s a good segue into the first part of this podcast. Before we go there, I wanna read the, the words of Zacharias, the father of John the Baptist, who, was filled with the Holy Spirit. Of course, he had been silent for nine months because he doubted, God’s promise to him about John the Baptist. But what he said tells us so much about the continuity of God’s plan.
And he said, and this is Luke one sixty eight to 70. Blessed is the Lord God of Israel for he has visited and redeemed His people and has raised up a horn of salvation for us in the house of His servant David, as He spoke by the mouth of His holy prophets who have been since the world began. You know, a horn of salvation is a Hebrew idiom for a mighty conquering deliverer. And Zechariah, his Zechariah’s, he roots the moment of, you know, he knows that Christ’s birth is imminent in the Davidic covenant, and the prophetic word that has been spoken since the world began. In other words, it was before Moses, it was before Sinai, was before the law was given.
The gospel in other words, wasn’t a New Testament invention. It was always the plan.
John McLarty: Right. This message of salvation as he spoke by the mouth of his holy prophets and the key phrase, who have been since the world began.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. Yes. So again, going back to our initial thoughts about this being just a doctrine that has not really been hammered home. Reason I think this is one reason I think this is so important is that when we make a different claim for salvation based on a period of time, it it it really impugns the nature of God.
John McLarty: Right. So just a little hint of this of, he spoke by the mouth of his holy prophets, have been since the world began. Before we get into the nature of God, who God is, it made me think of just a couple of passages out of Genesis. So back in the very beginning. And so a lot of folks are familiar with these stories, but they all tie together to this theme.
When Adam and Eve were deceived by the serpent, God cursed the serpent and he said, You are cursed above all the cattle, above what the beast of the field, upon thy belly thou shall go, thus shall eat all the days of thy life. And here’s kind of this prophecy here in verse it’s Genesis three fifteen. And I will put enmity between thee and the woman and between thy seed and her seed. It shall bruise thy head. So the serpent is gonna be defeated, and thou shall bruise his heel.
And I mean, there is a prophecy of Jesus Christ bruised in the heel.
Kimberly Faith: But
John McLarty: the serpent, the power of sin, the deceptiveness of sin and the power of sin, the result of sin is going to be defeated.
Kimberly Faith: It’s gonna be crushed.
John McLarty: And then so many people have heard this, you know, when Adam and Eve found their selves, they had sinned and covered themselves with fig leaves. And then in verse 21 of Genesis three, And to Adam also and his wife did the Lord God make coats of skins and clothe them. So to clothe them, to cover their awareness of their sin, kind of a lot of symbolism here, but it happened in truth too. Coats of skin, so animals had to be sacrificed. And then all in this same Genesis story, our listeners might remember the story of Cain and Abel.
And so Cain and Abel were the children. And in the process of time it came to pass that Cain brought fruit of the ground and offered it to the Lord. Cain brought just a
Kimberly Faith: Human religions.
John McLarty: Yeah, a vegetable.
Kimberly Faith: His own sacrifice.
John McLarty: And Abel brought her the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. So Cain had a sacrificial offering to the Lord and says the Lord had respect unto Abel and to his offering. So this idea that this sacrifice of an animal and the firstlings of his flock, you know, the best first. So again, just already in the Genesis showing the message of salvation of the lamb slain before the foundation of the world.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: So all these forms of early worship and pictures of Jesus Christ. We’re in the very beginning, the Genesis story.
Kimberly Faith: I love that. And that’s that’s really good to because I I I don’t think when when someone has been taught that keeping the law was and all the sacrifices was the way of salvation, they aren’t really thinking about before the law. Like, okay, so what what is that? What is it like Abraham and Job and Abel and Cain and all the you know? And so that’s a really good point.
We’re gonna kinda go over some of that history in the next segment, but let’s start with who God is. Because we know Malachi three six says, I am the Lord, I do not change. So that sets the stage for that that statement alone should tell us that if God doesn’t change, neither does salvation. Right? And, you know, because God’s nature we we talk about God’s nature so much in these, podcasts because it is literally the foundation of everything else.
And his nature, we actually spent quite a bit of time talking about that in fairly recent podcast because we and we talked about it in the context of of humanity and how we reflect his nature. But because he is love, he’s righteous and he’s just, that trifecta sets up the standard for how we must be reconciled to him. In other words, it’s his house, he gets to make the rules. It’s he is above us, he created everything and he he provided the way and it’s never changed.
John McLarty: And I think the real key there is so he’s righteous, just and loving. And something that really puts some teeth into that is he can’t be He’s infinitely those things.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: So he can’t be unrighteous, he can’t be unloving, but he also can’t be unjust. So that’s never changed. So the rules of our relationship with him and sin and death and the solution, but they’re they have to be the same because he’s the same. It all emanates from his nature.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. And and, you know, we we’ve talked about God being infinite, so which requires an infinite price. And, you know, I mean, Romans six twenty three says, for the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Jesus Christ our Lord. If that had not been true in the Old Testament, how would it be true in the New Testament? You know, if the wages of sin wasn’t always death, and we know that’s talking about eternal death, right, the death of the soul and the spirit, but the gift of God is eternal life.
If that had somehow not been true in the old testament, how could it have ever been true? Know?
John McLarty: Yeah, that’s a great point. And that’s a comprehensive statement. For the wages of sin is death, so that’s always been true, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah, you think about it, wouldn’t it be just diabolical of God to change the rules in midstream? You know, to say, well, all you Old Testament people had to work and do all these sacrifices. And oh, by the way, since you didn’t have a temple for four hundred years, all y’all went to hell. Right. You know?
I mean, the four hundred years predating the birth of Christ, then nothing I mean, we don’t know what was going on. Well, we know some history, The Maccabees and different things like that. But, and and you think about, okay, what about the before the the tabernacle, before the temple?
John McLarty: Yeah. The the
Kimberly Faith: What were the rules? Right.
John McLarty: Formal yeah.
Kimberly Faith: Exactly.
John McLarty: The sacrificial, you know, forms of worship and and all the laws
Kimberly Faith: that I we still mean, why would God have a standard of grace for us and a standard of works for the people in the Old Testament? That no. Nobody in any any right mind could say that’s fair. And not that we’re, you know, we’re talking about fairness by man’s standard, we’re talking about fairness by the by the standard of God’s righteousness. You know, he is he is the one who makes the moral law that, that is revealed in his word that we can’t keep, you know.
John McLarty: And just what will tie into that is that because God’s infinitely just and we’ve the law of sin and death, which is the solution is Jesus Christ. So by works of the law, the flesh could never be justified.
Kimberly Faith: Exactly.
John McLarty: And that that did not that didn’t magically change in in the New Testament.
Kimberly Faith: Well, it kinda goes back to also what Jesus taught in the beatitudes, and we talked about in the in the second, of the series on our on the on the beatitudes or the attitudes of Christ, being poor in spirit. You know, that spiritual bankruptcy, that acknowledgment that we are completely without any means to save ourselves, that is always been the case.
John McLarty: Always been the
Kimberly Faith: I mean, can look in the Old Testament, and we’re gonna talk about the law now, but you can look in the Old Testament in the book of Isaiah where it says our righteousness is as filthy rags. And that’s a little bit off script here, but you know, you think about it, that means our best works. Sacrifices, you know, all the different rituals in the old testament, our best righteousness is as filthy rags because of who God is.
John McLarty: Because of who God is and he doesn’t change.
Kimberly Faith: Right. So let’s kind of shift out to the second part of this podcast, which is what was the point of the law? And what was the big point?
John McLarty: Well, and we’ve kind of been already hitting all around this, but if God’s nature never changes and if sin always required this perfect payment, then the animal sacrifices under the law were never the solution, can never have been the solution.
Kimberly Faith: Absolutely, you wanna read Hebrews ten:four, which kind of says it?
John McLarty: Yeah. It’s for it’s not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sin. So that means ever. Right. Only would this be pointless today, but it never did.
It’s not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. And the Bible isn’t And
John McLarty: this is Hebrews ten four. This is written written to the Hebrews.
Kimberly Faith: To the Jews. Right. You know, it’s the Bible doesn’t beat around the bush about this. And, so if it wasn’t to take away sin, what was the point? And I think, I think there’s there’s at least two things we can talk about the point of law was for.
And, and why don’t we start with, well, just let’s just give everybody the the bottom line up front. You know, first, the law gives us the knowledge of sin and exposes it. And then it also brings us to Christ. It doesn’t just leave us there.
John McLarty: Yeah, it’s like a schoolmaster. So here’s a good Galatians three twenty four says, therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ that we might be justified by faith.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: So the law was showing us we had a problem.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: And that the solution was this sacrifice, but not bulls and goats. Right.
Kimberly Faith: Romans three twenty says, by the deeds of the law, no flesh will be justified in his sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin. Mhmm. So the law has this twofold purpose. Number one, to make us aware that we have a need, and number two, to show us that Jesus is the solution to our need.
John McLarty: That a sacrifice was needed.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. And and, you know, to
John McLarty: And then just think about this goes back to Cain and Abel. Right. We’re showing us the same thing.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. I mean, Abel’s sacrifice was showing he’s acknowledging he needs to sacrifice because the law and of course, we know the law is written in our heart. We have an because we have an idea who God is. But it exposed his sin, never removed it, but then the law, the animal sacrifice was like a dress rehearsal. You know, every lamb that was sacrificed was saying there is one, the Messiah who will come and do this perfectly and finally, and you can trust that.
John McLarty: And see, these are based on principles that emanate from God’s nature, which God’s nature. So it’s so clear. And this is kind of foundational, almost biblical, some theology with the nature of God and the implications of that. But you know, we’re gonna see real life examples in the Old Testament where this is shown to be true.
Kimberly Faith: Exactly. You know, I like to think of the law as the diagnosis. You know, a doctor diagnoses you with cancer and he says, here’s the solution, But he’s not the solution. Right? He’s not and and then we have the great physician, Jesus Christ, who is the final solution.
Right? And you know,
John McLarty: Amen to that.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. And you know, here’s how Satan is always doing. He’s always up to his monkey business trying to deceive us and give us counterfeits. He uses the works idea to just like you read about Cain, right? What was Cain doing?
He was offering his own version of religion satisfy what only Jesus Christ
John McLarty: The fruits of his hands.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. And that’s not a new I mean, that’s not an outdated thing. We’ve talked about human religions in our study, the concept study. And that’s what when we’re going our way to solve the anxiety, the spiritual anxiety that we have instead of through Jesus Christ for salvation, then we are we’ve been deceived. And for Christian, our Christian walk, it’s the same thing.
John McLarty: Exactly.
Kimberly Faith: You know? It’s not that we could ever lose our our standing before God because we’re in Christ and we can never be out of Christ. It’s a genetic thing. But man, the cure is always full going back to the the the first beatitude, being poor in spirit in the way that we live our life knowing that we are nothing without Christ, you know. So that’s a little bit of a divergence, but we’ll get back to what you said.
Let’s go back to Abraham.
John McLarty: Well, but, you know, I’m just thinking of the verses. By works of righteousness, you know, we’re never justified. We’re saved by grace through faith.
Kimberly Faith: Yes.
John McLarty: And we’re just that’s clear in the New Testament, but we’re taking that all the way back to it’s always been that way because God’s nature’s that way.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: So, yeah, Abraham real people, real life examples are just the through the Old Testament.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Why don’t you, so let’s talk let’s talk about Abraham, because we know Abraham was also before the law. Right. The the law that was given at Sinai. And let’s just read Romans chapter four verse three.
John McLarty: And it says, for what does the scripture say? Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness. Romans four three.
Kimberly Faith: That’s just straight up. I mean, he believed God just like we believe God. It’s not talking about believing God’s existence. We know that’s talking about salvation because of the word righteousness.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: You know, it wasn’t self righteousness. This was Christ’s righteousness. So Abraham was looking forward. He knew that Christ would come, the Messiah would come. Right.
And he he was given faith by God to believe in that because it’s a supernatural thing. And he believed it and it was righteousness was accounted to his sin debt.
John McLarty: Right. He, he he trusted in God’s promises.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right.
John McLarty: He didn’t just believe in that God was real. He trusted in God’s promise.
Kimberly Faith: In the messianic yeah. Right. And this was four hundred and thirty years before the law was given. You know, so it couldn’t have possibly the law couldn’t have possibly been a basis for his salvation. And then, you know, this is worth mentioning, that the life of David, even though that’s not really on our list of things to do in this podcast.
Let’s cover. Let’s talk let’s read Psalms 32. Well, let’s read Romans chapter four verses five through eight, which where Paul is quoting Psalms 32, which is David’s words of celebration over the forgiveness he’s received.
John McLarty: Yeah. So this is interesting because we have Abraham before the law and then here’s David during the law.
Kimberly Faith: And
John McLarty: Paul says, but to him who does not work, but believes on him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness. Just as David also described the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works. Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven and whose sins are covered. Blessed is the man to whom the Lord shall not impute sin. So here’s David and he’s, you know, referring back to, Psalm 32.
Kimberly Faith: Right. Right. And and so David and understand that righteousness was imputed. In other words, credited to the one who believes, not the one who earns it. And this is, you know, this is king David celebrating a Psalm a thousand years before Paul even wrote, you know, wrote his word, inspired by the holy spirit.
So and and I think this is critical too. Paul is writing the New Testament, quoting an Old Testament king to prove salvation is not grace through faith.
John McLarty: Perfect.
Kimberly Faith: And so, you know, I think Paul let’s read Galatians chapter three verse 11, because I think this is, you know, the theme that salvation is done by grace through faith is often quoted by the New Testament writers citing the Old Testament. Because Paul writes in Galatians three eleven, citing Habakkuk two four. So do you wanna read both those verses?
John McLarty: Yeah. Genesis, Galatians three eleven. But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident for, quote, the just shall live by faith.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: Then in Habakkuk, it said, and that’s two four, behold the proud, his soul is not upright in him, but the just shall live by faith.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. It’s in other words, from the beginning
John McLarty: From the very beginning.
Kimberly Faith: This the fact that this idea that the people in the Old Testament were saved differently than the New Testament wasn’t even a thought with the New Testament, the first century Christians, because they knew the Bible. You know? And and really, that’s what it comes down to. We don’t know our Bible like we need to. And that’s why, you know, again, I’m not sitting here claiming to be the pariah of scripture knowledge.
I’m just saying this is important because it goes back to not impugning the nature of God. God God you know, we’ve talked about who the enemies of God are, Satan, the world culture, and and and the flesh. But I’m gonna tell you in my observations and in my own life, I think sometimes the greatest enemy enemies of God are people who claim to be believers because we don’t know the truth and we don’t live the truth the way that we we should. And I’ve been that enemy of God. So I’m not I’m not, you know, indicting anyone but myself, But it’s so important that if we claim to be Christians that we know God for who he says he is and properly represent him.
And that’s why this is such an important, idea.
John McLarty: Yeah. And you think of one of Satan’s great deceptions is that you can become right with God through
Kimberly Faith: works. Right.
John McLarty: Which, you know, rules out faith. Yes. And leads people astray.
Kimberly Faith: But leads people straight to hell. Yeah. I mean, that’s just put it bluntly, it’s not it’s not like, there’s any room for if God truly is righteous, just, and loving, and he cannot act outside of that because that is his very nature or he would not be God, then that means he must his justice requires the exacting penalty. And to work our way is a big fat lie.
John McLarty: So think about this. It’s this misconception of the Old Testament, New Testament that salvation was different and that salvation in the Old Testament involved works. That’s like Satan getting his foot in the door. Like, well, that is possible. Yes.
Or that’s how it was in the old testament.
Kimberly Faith: Therefore, could be that
John McLarty: way Therefore, could be that way now, this little mixture of grace and works, which just clearly isn’t the way. We’re saved by grace through faith alone.
Kimberly Faith: If you think about where the religious leadership was when Jesus appeared on the scene, they were so far from grace.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: They were doing, you know, you gotta tithe, you know,
John McLarty: You were a racked through the axle of works.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. You gotta tithe your cumin and your coriander and, you know, I mean, and and oh, by the way, give that to us. I mean, was all about it was a man made religion. Yeah. And you know, that’s a dangerous place to be.
And here’s the thing, I don’t wanna be in that position of leading people astray. I don’t wanna be the one who takes down the sign that says river bridge washed out ahead.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: And watch people going, you know, sliding by or flying by in their cars a 100 miles an hour right towards that chasm. Mhmm. I wanna be the one standing in the way of those cars and saying, no, stop. This is not the way. You’re going to die.
And you only get one life to make it right. You know?
John McLarty: And so many think today that just, you know, this, know, that we live our life and you know, you do good and you do get bad and God’s going to just weigh the scales of your works.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: And that is so false. Yeah. He said, I’m the only way. It’s It’s always been.
Kimberly Faith: It’s so interesting. I was I was I appreciate you saying that because I was talking I was just listening really to a friend of mine who’s Jewish. And this this friend was kind of being, I don’t know, nonchalant about the ideas. It’s like, you know, well, you know, Judaism, we keep all these things, these laws and everything and you Christians, you work to, you know, work your way to heaven a different way. And I was just like, wow, you know, that
John McLarty: Right there.
Kimberly Faith: It’s such a lie. It’s such a lie. But I I think that there’s a lot more people who believe that than who believe salvation is purely by grace through faith and not of works. Right. And so that’s why this is so important.
So going on, Job. Job, you know
John McLarty: Amazing book.
Kimberly Faith: Amazing book.
John McLarty: Amazing story.
Kimberly Faith: Possibly the oldest book in the Bible. Certainly before the law, before Moses, before Psalms. Here’s Job in the middle of unimaginable suffering. Yeah. I recently did a little study in the book of Job just because I was feeling, I’m probably feeling a little sorry for myself.
I had this cough and this sickness for, I don’t know, eight weeks. And in the midst of that, I got up in the middle of the night. I’d been coughing so much, I felt like I’d been doing a plank for an hour, my abs hurt so bad. And I just like, Lord, I’m gonna read the book of Job. Know, I’m sure he inspired that, but I was thinking about, you know, as I was reading Job and I don’t think I had put together the fact that Satan when Satan came, you know, into God’s presence and said, you know, look at God’s saying, look at my man Job, you know, kinda bragging on him, if that’s, you know, probably not the right word to assemble.
God can brag, I guess, because he deserves all the glory and praise. But
John McLarty: God was proud of him.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. And and and Job and and Satan was like, well, you know, if you take away everything he has, he’s not gonna praise you. So God said, alright, but you can’t take his life. Right? And so Satan goes out and tragically, you know, kills all of his children.
He or has his children killed. He, you know, destroys everything he has. Lost
John McLarty: everything.
Kimberly Faith: And Job’s response was naked came I out of my mother’s womb and naked I shall return. The Lord gives and the Lord takes away. Blessed be the name of the Lord. And so Satan goes back and says, well, you know, if you let me harm him physically, if you let me take away his health, then he’ll curse you. And so here’s Job, and of course that’s exact he had I actually studied it and wrote a little devotional about this.
Job had actually 10 horrible physical conditions going on, Like his skin was black, his bones were brittle, his breath stunk, his teeth were rotting out. I mean, all these things. And so, you know, here he is in the middle of unimaginable suffering and he’s sitting on
John McLarty: This is an aside, is that when Satan has his liberty, that’s
Kimberly Faith: That’s what he does.
John McLarty: He wants to really lay it on us.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. He’s
John McLarty: Good example of that.
Kimberly Faith: He’s sitting on ash heap and he’s scraping his sores with broken pottery. And this is after his friends have spent, you know, just all these long lectures saying he must have sinned, he needs to repent. Then Job says something that it just it’s it’s stunning and it’s such a revelation of the absolute certainty he had of who he was in Christ. And you wanna read, Job nineteen twenty five to 27?
John McLarty: Yeah. I’ll have to read with just a little commentary because this this first line, for I know that my redeemer liveth lives. So here’s Job.
Kimberly Faith: Mhmm.
John McLarty: Way back before the law.
Kimberly Faith: Thousands of years.
John McLarty: And uses the word redeemer, which means one who buys back. Buys back from or pays the price. Right. So this idea that a price had to be paid. So not by works of righteousness, but we need a redeemer.
Kimberly Faith: We
John McLarty: need a lamb of God. So Job saying this, For I know that my redeemer, that word redeemer, lives, and he shall stand at last on the earth and after my skin is destroyed, this I know, that in my flesh I shall see God whom I shall see for myself and my eyes shall behold and not another how my heart yearns within me. Job knew we needed a redeemer.
Kimberly Faith: Well, I also just wanna wanna talk about the tense of this this word lives. He’s not saying will live. He’s not saying has lived. Mhmm. He’s saying present tense lives.
In other words, Job’s faith in God, his belief in God was present tense. It didn’t matter that that hadn’t already happened. Jesus hadn’t already become incarnate, because Job knew God’s word was good today.
John McLarty: And I am slain before the foundation of the world.
Kimberly Faith: Exactly. And and so this is not a new idea. You know, the big idea is people before Christ look forward, but in their mind, it already happened because God’s word is good.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: We look back and have faith in the history of what happened, but we know the work is present. Work is present on both ends. It is. You know?
John McLarty: It’s really God’s spirit re showing us that it’s the truth. Right. On both sides, you might say, both sides of the old and new testament.
Kimberly Faith: Yes.
John McLarty: It’s it’s God’s spirit shows us in our heart that this is the this is the truth. Jesus is the way.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. And you know what? Just as a side, you know, here’s Job in the depth of more misery than we can really conceive, And he has more personal confidence in the resurrection, his resurrection, and what Christ has done for him than I think a lot of us do sitting in our comfortable pews and living in our comfortable houses. And I think one of the full circle things God was teaching me during my illness was that it shouldn’t take illness for me to live in that acute awareness of God’s presence. You know, this pain and suffering, someday we’re not gonna we’re not gonna experience it anymore, you know.
But, you know, we have because Jesus Christ has already finished the work of salvation in us, we have such freedom in any circumstance. You know, Paul was the one who said, I know whatever state I am in to be content. I know how to be abound to abound and be abased. I’m just meant just doing this from memory. But I know that I have what I need, everything I need whether my circumstances are great or not great.
And, you know, I can do all things through Christ. Right?
John McLarty: Yeah. That’s great. So We know our redeemer liveth. Right. Right.
But And that we will that our eyes shall behold and not another, how my heart yearns within me.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. Yes. And so it’s clear Job was not trusting in law keeping or his own righteousness or sacrifice. And that, again, going back to that, that bankruptcy, example that we used in the second beatitude, podcast, his debt was paid in full. His righteousness was credited to his sin debt.
He didn’t have to worry about it. He didn’t have to worry about it.
John McLarty: He knew it in the present tense. He knew his redeemer liveth and that he would stand with him. Yeah, Job did qualify that with, you know, if I keep the laws and keep doing good works. So he knew at that point in time, this was his situation, this was his status.
Kimberly Faith: Right. And even centuries after Job, but still like seven hundred years before the cross, we we find in the book of Isaiah this remarkable passage. Of course, Isaiah 53, it’s all these pro and Isaiah the book and Jeremiah have all these prophetic passages. But let’s read Isaiah 50 three:five.
John McLarty: Well, and this is amazing because it ties in that this Redeemer, this lamb that the Old Testament saints were all referring to, is so perfectly described in Isaiah 50 three:five that it was Jesus. It was the death of the cross. And so Isaiah says, For he was wounded for our transgressions. Then this is seven hundred years before the cross.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: He was wounded for our transgressions. He was bruised for our iniquities. The chastisement of our peace was upon him and by his stripes we are healed. Well, who could that be talking about?
Kimberly Faith: Well, and think about this, Isaiah is this prophecy is written in past tense. The the three things wounded for our transgressions, bruised for our iniquities, and the chastisement of our peace for our for our peace was upon him. That’s all past tense. And then he says, by his stripes, we are healed.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: It was talking about himself. You know, even though this wasn’t gonna happen for seven hundred more years, because Isaiah trusted the nature and character of God.
John McLarty: In the mind of God, it had already happened.
Kimberly Faith: It already happened.
John McLarty: And the Old Testament saints could believe it and trust it just Absolutely. Like we
Kimberly Faith: You know, they had that faith that God gave them, that God’s word is good. And if he said that a Messiah was gonna do these things, that they could trust him and that faith was counted to them for righteousness. So, so amazing. And, you know, and it’s also very comforting because we can know that the promises of God in his word, what all the prompt like, let’s just take promises about prayer. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man avails much.
That’s a promise. Why we why do we say, well, I can’t do anything about it, so let I’ll just have to pray. That’s such a that’s such a mischaracterization of this great gift we’ve been given. And I’ve actually stopped saying that. Well, I try I catch myself saying it, but then I have to correct myself.
Wait a minute. No, God. Prayer should be my first response, not my last resort. Before I try, I need to pray.
John McLarty: Yeah. I’m just kinda thinking, we should and can live our Christian life just like we obtain salvation.
Kimberly Faith: That’s a great point. It’s a great point.
John McLarty: Just by trusting God.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. And honestly
John McLarty: Believing in his promises.
Kimberly Faith: If you think about the frailty of our health, our wealth, our life, you know, I mean, any moment, somebody could blow up my office or do whatever, right? But we are so frail. We live fearlessly when we live claiming God’s promises or living out God’s promise. Not just name it and claim it, I’m not talking about that. I’m talking about living it.
There’s a big difference. When you live fearlessly, you know, when you take the step God’s leading you to do without seeing that it’s gonna work, that’s a may that’s an amazing life. That’s the greatest adventure. And I know the times in my life when I’ve been there, it’s like, would I wanna live in the predictable when I can live in the great adventure, you know?
John McLarty: Now, we’re saved by grace through faith and then we live in faith. Right, right. And we say that, I think of the example of our associate pastor Pat Briney, we trust in Christ fully for salvation. Then he’s an example, I think you can get a mental picture of this, of he partially sat down. He had a bench beneath
Kimberly Faith: it and
John McLarty: just almost sat on it, but it was in this extreme stress resting in that he can go ahead and sit down.
Kimberly Faith: He was still fully engaging his muscles to stay away.
John McLarty: You know? So why why would we live the Christian life like that?
Kimberly Faith: That’s a great point, dad. That’s a great point. Salvation is the foundation for a life that is lived in freedom
John McLarty: In freedom.
Kimberly Faith: Trusting God.
John McLarty: Trusting and resting. Yes. Yes. Which gives peace.
Kimberly Faith: You know, before we kind of, move on, well, let’s let’s kind of I think it’s important for us to set the stage where when Christ Jesus actually came. So we’re we’ve talked about the old testament and, you know, we of course are living in the church age. But let’s kind of, just dial back for a minute and go to the actual time of Christ’s birth. And because this is kind of the hinge point between the old New Testament. Right?
And the the gospel of Luke just gives us these beautiful pictures of two people, Simeon and Anna, who were had were in the temple, had been in the temple, been in the waiting. They’ve been waiting for the Messiah. And I think the reason they’ve been waiting for the Messiah, not this speculation, but they probably knew the book of Daniel. They knew when, the time approximate time frame when Christ would be born. Right.
And and you know, so they understood that.
John McLarty: Yes. They’re anticipating the savior, the becoming messiah.
Kimberly Faith: Right. And so the day that Mary and Joseph brought Jesus into the temple for the purification, writes, they they’re kind of the living proof of everything we’ve been talking about. And so, the first is Simeon. Do you wanna kind of bring some speed on Simeon?
John McLarty: Yeah. So and this is really interesting that he hadn’t seen Jesus’ miracles yet. He hadn’t heard any sermons. But here was the child. And he was holding the child and he prophesied kind of in the spirit.
It says this prayer, Lord, now you are letting your servant depart in peace according to your word for my eyes have seen your salvation, which you have prepared before the face of all peoples, a light to bring revelation to the Gentiles and the glory of your people, Israel.
Kimberly Faith: Isn’t that amazing? Think about how he said that. And of course it was inspired, Revelation to the Gentiles and the glory of your people Israel. It’s like, that’s a story that he knew was going to be written and this was it’s the same story they’ve been waiting for for millennia before, and it’s the it’s the it’s the fruition of his personal salvation. It’s the it’s okay.
It’s come. The Messiah has come. All the all the prophets, you know, Job, Abraham, David, all these greats that he obviously knew about Mhmm. Had said, you know, this is God’s word. This is his promise, and oh, here it is.
What a great time to be alive.
John McLarty: Yeah. He says and despairing it. Now letting your servant depart in peace. Right. He says, my eyes have seen your salvation.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. And then and then there was Anna. This is so interesting, because Anna, is called a prophetess, and she’s she’s from the tribe of Asher. And Asher was one of the northern tribes that had really just been scattered into I mean, they’d been assimilated. They were not even identifiable.
And she’s in the temple, and just her backstory, she’d been married for seven years, then widowed. She’d never remarried, been in the temple. She’s 84 years old, and she’d been in the temple fasting and praying. Again, I think she knew the prophecies about when the Christ child was when the Messiah was gonna be born. And she she was waiting on this promise and she said in Luke two thirty eight, coming in that instance, she gave thanks to the Lord and spoke of him to all those who looked for redemption in Jerusalem.
So, you know, Anna was testifying. She was spreading here, your Messiah is born. She was proclaiming the Messiah. And I you know, she’s the first person recorded in Luke’s gospel to announce the Messiah.
John McLarty: And just think of the word used there redemption. So think of Job referred to my Redeemer. This idea of redemption. He who will buy back, he who will pay the price. And that that is amazing.
Kimberly Faith: It’s so amazing because, know, think about both Simi and Anna, you know, they there’s no record that they they were around for the resurrection, the crucifixion. Don’t know. But like you said, they knew he was the redeemer. And this is without you
John McLarty: And therefore they knew they needed to be redeemed. Right. And that not by works of the law were they going to be justified.
Kimberly Faith: Right. Right. And so kind of also just moving forward, I’d like to just kind of this segment is is just so rich, but I’d like to go up, to Acts chapter three verses 18 through 21, because this is just weeks after the resurrection. And he’s Peter is standing on Solomon’s porch and talking about, the basically, the this is this is what God this is what the God promised, and this is the fulfillment of that promise. And he says, but those things which God foretold by the mouth of all of his prophets that the Christ would suffer, he has thus fulfilled, whom heaven must receive until the times of the restoration of all things, which God has spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
John McLarty: That’s perfect.
Kimberly Faith: It’s yeah. I mean, it’s literal. This isn’t like
John McLarty: Peter was explaining to this big crowd, this is kind of after the day of Pentecost
Kimberly Faith: and
John McLarty: people were going, what’s happening? And he was explaining, you shouldn’t be surprised by this, hardly people.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: This is what has been talked about since the very beginning.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Yeah. And it’s Spoken
John McLarty: by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
Kimberly Faith: It it’s it’s just it’s so beautiful when you understand, number one, who God is so that when you read the bible, when you read the things in the scripture that seem to contradict his nature, you know there’s gotta be a different interpretation. You know what I’m saying? I mean, if you read, for example, something in the Old Testament that makes it sound like these sacrifices were taking away their sins. Right. You know that can’t be true.
There has to be different interpretation for that because of who God is and he is a foundation for all, of truth.
John McLarty: And just think about this, Kim. I just thought of this. The leaders of Israel and this is a warning for Christian dumb today.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: The leaders of Israel had gotten so wrapped up in the works of the law that actually was part of their power structure. Yes. Is controlling the works of the law.
Kimberly Faith: Being in power.
John McLarty: Yes. How people, you know, obeyed the works of the law.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: But when Jesus when the redeemer actually came, they missed it.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. That’s so that’s scary. And and, you know, we I don’t think we talked about this. I get I get my the devotional writing in the podcast mixed up. So one of the things that I I remember is Jesus when he told he told the religious leaders, the house has been taken from you and given to another, and I’m paraphrasing.
How it was sad to him, you know, because later in that same chapter, that I think is the same chapter, maybe that a couple chapters after, and I don’t remember which which book of, the gospel it’s in, but he was weeping over Jerusalem and saying, how I would have gathered you to me, and I’m way off script right now when it comes to what I’m talking about. But you know, Jesus, when you were talking about the religious leaders, this is truly a warning for everybody now because if you’re preaching a different gospel, a gospel that involves in any way a work that must be done in order to make up, fill the gap in what Jesus wasn’t adequate to do, then think about that. That is that’s enough to send somebody straight to hell. Mhmm. And and suffer eternal separation from the presence of God.
What a tragedy.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: And if you believe that yourself, what a tragedy.
John McLarty: Mhmm.
Kimberly Faith: What a you’re missing out. I mean, you’re missing out on not only your eternal life, but the gift of salvation as lived today in this hard, hard world we live in. And go ahead, you had
John McLarty: No, I’m just saying and that’s what had happened to the leadership of the nation of Israel. And it’s not just a small doctrinal error, it cost salvation
Kimberly Faith: to people. Yes. Themselves.
John McLarty: Misunderstanding of what we’re talking about. Right. Cost salvation. They’re they’re because they were teaching this false doctrine back then.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: And then they followed even after and then you said, they followed Paul around trying to say, oh, no. No. You can’t you’re not saved just by Jesus.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: You also have to keep the words of the law.
Kimberly Faith: Well
John McLarty: They they didn’t give it up.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. And even if you look at, I I think it’s in the book of Galatians, but I could be wrong, where Peter kind of went astray. Mhmm. And Paul had to straighten him out. Peter was trying to get circumcision, all these other things back in there to you know, you gotta kinda keep the law.
He was feeling the pressure of these Judaizers. Right. Right? And it didn’t I mean, this is in the first century. Right.
You know, they’ve experienced Jesus. They’ve seen him, his body, his his transformed body, and they’re starting Satan’s already working. Oh, let’s get works back in there. You know, let’s let’s pull the gospel apart again.
John McLarty: And that’s kinda what I was saying. This is an alert to Christendom today.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: Is that, you know, to insert that’s what happened in the old testament.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: It was salvation, the Redeemer, you know, by grace through faith and then the religious structures wanna put works back into it.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah, and if you’re listening to this podcast and you’re engaged in a religious structure that says we have to be baptized to be saved, That that completely violates the scripture that says there’s well, acts four twelve, there’s salvation. There’s nor is there salvation in any other, for there’s no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved. And and or if you’re in a religious structure that says you have to do the, communion, you have to confess to a priest, you have to do whatever to make sure you’re saved, you have to speak in tongues. I’m not I’m not saying that I’m not picking on a religion. I’m just saying compare what you’re being told from your religious leaders to what the Bible says, to what Jesus said.
Because if says I am the way, I am the truth, I am the life, and no man comes to the Father but by me, that’s crystal clear. It’s not baptism, it’s not anything else, it’s by him.
John McLarty: Well, a great first kind of to fit into this is Paul speaking in Romans four. And actually, I wanna go back to verse twenty, twenty even through 25.
Kimberly Faith: Okay.
John McLarty: So Paul’s talking, and this is Paul talking about Abraham. This makes it so clear the kind of belief Abraham had. And so it’s not of works, but it’s a particular kind of belief that he, talking about Abraham, he staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strong in faith giving glory to God and being fully persuaded that what he had promised he was able to perform. So trusting in his Redeemer. And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.
And then Paul says in verse 23, Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, but for us also. So Paul’s tying the Old Testament to the New Testament.
Kimberly Faith: That’s really good.
John McLarty: Abraham to today’s, you know.
Kimberly Faith: It was written for us.
John McLarty: Yes. This is after, you know, to the saints after the
Kimberly Faith: Resurrection.
John McLarty: The death, burial and resurrection.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: Now it was written not for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, but for us also to whom it shall be imputed if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead, who was delivered for our offenses and raised for our justification.
Kimberly Faith: I think that’s great, dad. You know, I think when we really and just to tie this part up about our best is still not good enough.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: And that’s actually good news, because you know, Isaiah sixty four six says, but we are all like an unclean thing and all our righteousness is like filthy rags. We all fade as a leaf and our iniquities like the wind has taken us away. And you contrast that with, like, that’s a that’s a verse that makes us feel like, oh my gosh. So what then can we do?
John McLarty: And just just to pause here, think that’s, that’s Old Testament. That’s Old Testament. That’s Old Testament saying our righteousness is as filthy rags. Right. So not of works, lest any man should boast.
Kimberly Faith: Sacrifice is Old Testament. Sacrifices, you know, all the things, that’s righteousness, right, Or our our acts of righteousness. But that makes the good news even better. I mean, even more clear because for second Corinthians five twenty one says, for he made him who knew no sin to be sin for us. Why?
That we might become the righteousness of God in him. What a beautiful verse. You know, that just sums it all up. The whole Old Testament law was to show us we couldn’t keep the law and Christ fulfilled the law. Two things.
And then he came, and the Old Testament people believed in God’s promises that he would come as if they happen today.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: And then he did that. He became sin. But see, Abraham knew that Christ
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: Would become sin, and he would know not he would be perfect, and he would provide this righteousness.
John McLarty: He believed it and trusted it, and it was we just read it was accounted to him for righteousness.
Kimberly Faith: Exactly. Exactly.
John McLarty: So that we might become the righteousness of God in him.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. So,
John McLarty: you know, Abraham, that’s what Abraham did.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah.
John McLarty: That’s what David did.
Kimberly Faith: And and, you know, if you’re listening to this podcast and you’re resting in the righteousness of God, that’s so freeing. That’s so freeing. But if you’re still secretly trying to earn your own way, that’s bondage. And, you know, Christ Jesus said if the son of man have set you free, you are free indeed. What he meant by that is you are free from the bondage of sin.
And if you’re still living under the guilt and bondage of sin, there’s two possible explanations. Number one, you’ve never been born again. Or number two, you have gone back to the idea that you have to earn God’s favor, God’s help, God’s, you know, whatever, you know, your peace.
John McLarty: Sure. That just brings anxiety.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: Yeah. And and that’s, which makes you less fruitful.
Kimberly Faith: Right. It’s it’s it’s such a remarkable thing that, you know, again, I’m gonna go back to that first beatitude. Blessed are the poor in spirit. Right? And the second one, blessed are they who mourn.
Talking about mourning sin. And those two beatitudes, those two attitudes of Christ that he taught us bring us to salvation and they give us an abundant life. Because when we come to Jesus for salvation, understanding we’re fully bankrupt, there’s no good things that we can do, and that we don’t want to live this in the same sin we’ve been trapped and enslaved in our whole life, which is repentance. Right? Mhmm.
And we trust Jesus for as our Lord and savior, then we are set free. Our soul and spirit are redeemed. His Christ’s righteousness is accounted to our debt and paid in full. But then as a born born again believer, we also need to understand how dependent we are on on Jesus Christ. And we also need to retrain our flesh is no better than the day it was born again, that we were born again.
Flesh is not born again. So we have to cut new grooves in our brain to hate sin. You know? I mean, that’s just the bottom line. Because if we go back to that bondage and that struggle is in every born again believer, we’ve talked about that Romans chapter seven where Paul says, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
I do what I don’t wanna do, and that what I wanna do, I don’t do. You know, the whole struggle.
John McLarty: Struggle of the Christian life.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. Mhmm. That’s right. And and you don’t have to live exhausted because
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: You you really don’t. I mean, if you’re born again, the whole idea is you have to grow. You have to be transformed by the renewing of your mind, is the way Paul talked about it in Romans chapter one. And so if you’re listening to this and you’ve never been born again, today is the day of salvation. Don’t wait.
You don’t know when that cliff is coming over up that you’re gonna drive over. You don’t know you’re not promised one more day. And if you’re a born again believer, man, living for the glory of God is is basically surrender. It’s surrender.
John McLarty: It’s surrender and resting in Him, trusting That’s right. In
Kimberly Faith: mean, I’ll never forget, you know, and I don’t talk about this a lot and I don’t mean it as a brag at all, I just mean it as just the truth. I’ll never forget the time in my Christian life, and this is in the last probably six or seven years, where I actually, I began to really sense a strong presence of God in my life. And it was so good that in I finally recognized I loved the presence of God more than I loved my pet sins. And it was like, why would it was kinda like I could see the ocean, and I could see the ghetto, and I wanted the ocean more because the ghetto was revealed for what it actually was, bondage, filth, slavery, misery, all those things. And that’s what sin is.
That’s That’s
John McLarty: interesting because you’re speaking as a Christian.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right.
John McLarty: You come back.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. That’s right.
John McLarty: Away from, the presence of God in your daily living.
Kimberly Faith: Right. And so, you know, it’s just it’s just such a great to understand this that, you know, that the whole idea of salvation is the same in the Old Testament. The principle, the truth of salvation, I should say not the idea, as it is today is so important because it shows that God’s character and His nature are the same as it’s always been. And we long for that. We long for that consistency, for a standard of truth that we can trust in.
And, you know, for believers, what a what a great freedom we’re given to live in this amazing promise that our debt is paid in full.
John McLarty: Well, think of that verse. Jesus Christ is this is Hebrews thirteen eight. Again, interestingly enough, Hebrews written to the Jews.
Kimberly Faith: Yes.
John McLarty: Jesus Christ at the same yesterday, today, and forever. So yesterday refers all the way back to The beginning. The beginning, And so the same Jesus that the Old Testament saints trusted in, we trust in not only for salvation, then as you’re pointed out, for the Christian life, not to keep our salvation.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: But to keep that presence of God that you just talked about. Yeah. That’s so, that is so much part of the abundant life.
Kimberly Faith: It’s so freeing. So freeing to know that God is who he says he is. And you know, just I just get so encouraged by the things that he’s teaching us and these, podcasts we’re sharing just because I wanna I want everyone to know what it the the experience of God’s presence, you know, just how it practically affects positively every area of our life if we allow it. And, so God, thanks for thanks for engaging this today. This has just been great.
John McLarty: It’s a great topic, and when you really dig into the Bible, it’s pretty clear that salvation has always been the same because God’s always been the
Kimberly Faith: same. Amen. Hey, friend. If this podcast lifted your heart or challenged your faith, imagine what God can do when you dive even deeper. That’s exactly what you’ll find at gofaithstrong.com, a growing hub of podcasts, devotionals, music, and resources to help you stay strong in your walk with Christ.
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He rescued me.
