Have you ever stood at the edge of a dance floor, watching everyone else move together, wondering if you’d ever really belong? It’s a feeling almost everyone has had — waiting to be chosen, to be favored by someone who is great or powerful. This question resurfaced in an unexpected way during a recent illness Kimberly went through. God kept bringing one truth back to her heart: She belonged to Him. Out of that season she was reminded of the picture C.S. Lewis described of the inner life with the Trinity as a great dance, dynamic and alive with love and motion. This dance that the Father, Son, and Spirit have been in since before time began.
To celebrate the 100th episode, Kimberly Faith and John McLarty talk about that dance — and about the astonishing fact that it was never meant to stay just between the three persons of the Godhead. It was always meant to include us. They show that in Genesis all three were present at creation and in John chapter 1 how each has a different role and invitation for us: the Father who runs to meet us like the father of the prodigal son, the Son who makes us joint heirs of an inheritance we can’t fully wrap our minds around, and the Spirit who intercedes for us, transforms us, and guides our steps like a patient dance instructor. Whatever wound or sense of not-quite-enough someone carries into this episode, Kim and John’s hope is the same one they close on: Nobody has to sit this one out. The invitation has already been given — the only question left is whether we’ll step onto the floor.
Key Takeaways:
Jacob Paul: Welcome to the Truth in Love podcast with your hosts Kimberly Faith and John Mac. The Truth in Love podcast seeks to present God’s timeless truth through the lens of his remarkable love.
Kimberly Faith: Well, dad, I can’t believe this is podcast 100.
John McLarty: That is really remarkable. 100.
Kimberly Faith: What a
John McLarty: What a milestone.
Kimberly Faith: Well and what a miracle, really.
John McLarty: Who would have thought it?
Kimberly Faith: You know, I think about when we started this idea of well, when God planted the idea because it definitely was him. I wasn’t looking for more work to do. I know you weren’t. You were trying to retire.
John McLarty: Well, that’s been ten years ago.
Kimberly Faith: Right. Right.
John McLarty: God has different ideas of retirement than the normal secular viewpoint.
Kimberly Faith: Absolutely. Well
John McLarty: And it’s a good thing.
Kimberly Faith: When I was praying about you know, I was super excited about doing Podcast 100. It just seems to be, like, you know, the centennial or something, right?
John McLarty: Something that should be special.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. And, so during a recent illness, one of the things that the Lord has kept hammering home to me is this idea that I belong. And when you’re sick and you’re isolated, you know, you start kind of questioning that. And so during that time period, some of the, I think God has just been teaching me some of the greatest things I’ve ever learned about him. And one of those has been about the trinity. And this particular podcast is titled the trinity, the father, son, and holy spirit’s personal invitation to the great dance. And, you know, this idea of the great dance isn’t something that I came up with. It’s something I heard, CS Lewis describe the inner life of the Trinity as a kind of dance. The trinity is dynamic, pulsating, full of life, and love, and motion.
John McLarty: A relationship.
Kimberly Faith: A relationship. Yeah.
John McLarty: A meaningful relationship.
Kimberly Faith: A beautiful relationship. And the thing that the Lord was kind of drawing me into was that this great dance that they have been in for we don’t know how long, but probably eternity past, is something that they want us to be part of.
John McLarty: They want, yes. How exciting.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. We you know,
John McLarty: We talked in our last podcast about, you know, purpose and meaning in life.
Kimberly Faith: Right. Right.
John McLarty: What a purpose to be part of the great work of God.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. And you think about, I don’t know if you’ve ever gone to a wedding and not felt like you could get on the dance floor because you didn’t have a partner or, you know, I’ve gone with friends that maybe just a group of friends and kind of sat at a table while everybody else was dancing and you kind of feel like that wallflower.
John McLarty: Right. Left out, do I belong?
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: Sure. I think we’ve all had an experience like that, maybe junior high, high school
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: Or something.
Kimberly Faith: It’s part of the universal experience.
John McLarty: It is.
Kimberly Faith: We want to belong.
John McLarty: Yes.
Kimberly Faith: We want to be chosen. We want to be invited. Not as some afterthought or we need another person, so why don’t you come? But genuinely
John McLarty: Oh, okay. My memory. Sixth grade baseball, they would choose two teams. There’d be two leaders and they would choose, oh, I’ll, you know, you be on my team, then the other guy gets a choice.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: And it was a horrifying thought to be the last person. I don’t think I ever was, but I was close to it because I wasn’t very good.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah.
John McLarty: But that idea, I’m not, I don’t want to be the last chosen.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. That’s a great example.
John McLarty: Yeah.
Kimberly Faith: Wait. I think everybody has been in that position.
John McLarty: Exactly. In some way or another.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. And, you know, we don’t want to be an afterthought. We don’t. We want to be genuinely, deliberately, personally invited. And not just anything, but it’s something that matters. You know, we talked about our purpose, like you said, in the last podcast. And, you know, the incredible, just precious thought that we’re going to talk about today is that each part of the Trinity has gone to breathtaking lengths to make sure that we are aware of the priceless invitation we’ve been given
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: To step into the most beautiful, intimate fellowship and purpose that’s ever existed. And so that’s what we’re going to do today.
John McLarty: Amen. Let’s do it.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Let’s do it. So just so everybody understands kind of where we’re going, we’re going to talk about this great dance that has been, that existed before we did. Okay?
John McLarty: For sure.
Kimberly Faith: And, then we’re going to talk about the father’s invitation, the son’s invitation, the holy spirit’s invitation
John McLarty: That’s great.
Kimberly Faith: And that everybody’s invited.
John McLarty: I love it.
Kimberly Faith: So that’s where we’re going to go. So let’s talk about
John McLarty: Whosoever will may come.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. Let’s talk about this dance that existed before we did, and we don’t really know how long. Okay? But the Bible opens with these four amazing words, in the beginning, God. God was present. And we know that all three persons of the Trinity are visible in the first
John McLarty: Right. There was already a relationship.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. And why don’t you read Genesis 1:1-3 just to kind of
John McLarty: That’s great. Yeah.
Kimberly Faith: Show that relationship that was there at the beginning of time of, what we know as time.
John McLarty: Yeah. In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth, and the earth was without form and void, and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters. Then God said, let there be light, and there was light. And let me just kind of add to that, not to get too deep into the theology of it. But in Hebrews Chapter One, it makes clear that the son created. The son was the creator of this world.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: So right here, you have God, the spirit, and the son all involved in Genesis 1:1.
Kimberly Faith: Well, we also know, I appreciate you bringing that up because John One talks about Jesus, in the beginning was the word.
John McLarty: Yes.
Kimberly Faith: And the word was with God and the word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him.
John McLarty: Created by him.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: So even though the son isn’t specifically mentioned in Genesis 1:1-3, it’s clear he was there. All things were created by him.
Kimberly Faith: And God said, that’s the word. Let there be light, and there was light. So we know the father was purposing creation. The spirit was hovering over, you know, the face of the deep, so to speak, like a mother bird almost, you know, waiting for the chicks to arrive, you know? And the son, the living word, was the spoken word into you know, the light into darkness.
John McLarty: Beautiful.
Kimberly Faith: It’s so beautiful.
John McLarty: They all had a part.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. Yes. And this is so indicative.
John McLarty: Fascinating.
Kimberly Faith: It’s so indicative of the relationship that all three are extending this invitation to every human. And also kind of shows the beauty of the relationship God has with himself. You know? I like to, and this is a, you know, probably something we’ll talk about in another podcast. But this idea of did the trinity always exist or was God something different, you know, I don’t know the answer to that. But I can tell you there’s a couple of things. One thing mom brought up actually is God, the Bible says, God, I’m the same. He never changes, right? So if he was a trinity now, then he was a trinity then. That’s a real logical conclusion. And this is a little bit off script, but the other part is the word love, we know that the Bible says God is love. The meaning of love necessarily implies relationship. And you can’t have love without a relationship. You can’t have love in isolation. And so to me, that implies the trinity always existed because if God is love and, of course, we’re just speculating. But
John McLarty: Yeah.
Kimberly Faith: You know?
John McLarty: And I’ll kind of, I guess the other side of that would be that God existed, if there was just this nontriune God.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: And because he is love, determined there needed to be a relationship.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: So, yeah, that’s an interesting question.
Kimberly Faith: It is.
John McLarty: Obviously, it either existed as a triune or
Kimberly Faith: Something else.
John McLarty: Or became before creation.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Yeah.
John McLarty: As soon as man comes onto the picture, mankind and creation, there’s the three. The three in one.
Kimberly Faith: And then you, but you also look at the book of Revelation and some of the books like Daniel and Isaiah. And, you know, when it talks about the millennial reign or what’s after the millennial reign, it seems to indicate that there’s still some form of trinity.
John McLarty: Oh, absolutely.
Kimberly Faith: You know? So anyway, it’ll be an interesting discussion I’m sure we will have one day. So let’s kind of move on to the next part of this, and that is the father and his invitation. And, you know, so I just want to take a pause here, because I know that for some people listening to this, the word father can carry a lot of pain, and sometimes more pain than comfort. And, you know, I was very blessed to have you as my father.
John McLarty: Well, thank you, Kim. I was blessed likewise.
Kimberly Faith: And I know you’re blessed by your father, you know. And even though you didn’t come on the scene till I was like eight, you know, I count it such a blessing to have had that modeling of God for me, God the father. But, you know, maybe somebody listening to this
John McLarty: Well, that’s due to God’s grace and our salvation.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. Maybe the father that anybody you know, somebody listening to this may have had was maybe harsh, maybe he was cold, unpredictable, maybe he was present but absent emotionally. You know, maybe he had his own damage that he was dealing with that kept him from being able to be all that he could be as a father for you and maybe made you feel like you weren’t quite enough. I think we all struggle with that. I mean, as a parent, we struggle with being everything we’re supposed to be for our children. And I don’t care how good of a parent you are. I’ve got lots of areas in my life where I did not fulfill the role of being a parent like I wish I had. And I think everybody that’s been a parent would probably echo that. But it’s very important that we understand when we’re talking about our heavenly father that he is not a magnified version of the wounded, limited, broken person who held that title.
John McLarty: I’m glad you’re bringing that up.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Because Jesus, and Jesus addresses this gap directly. And would you read Matthew 7:11?
John McLarty: Sure. If you then being evil know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask him?
Kimberly Faith: That is one of my favorite verses.
John McLarty: So even this ideal father on earth
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: That’s given good gifts to his children, how much more
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: Will your father, which is in heaven?
Kimberly Faith: Right. You think of every tender, protective, selfless impulse you’ve witnessed in any father, you know, even if it just gives glimpses of one or any, maybe you watched a movie and saw a father, you say, oh, I wish that guy was my father, you know, that finds that longing, finds its perfect, undiminished, inexhaustible source in our heavenly father.
John McLarty: Exactly.
Kimberly Faith: And it’s not, and he doesn’t love us because we’re lovable. He loves us, because it’s not something he does, it’s who he is.
John McLarty: Perfect.
Kimberly Faith: And in other words the very fabric
John McLarty: Traditional.
Kimberly Faith: Fabric of his nature. Do you want to read First John 4:8?
John McLarty: He who does not love does not know God, for God is love.
Kimberly Faith: Right. This isn’t conditional.
John McLarty: Doesn’t say God loves or God can love.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: God is love.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. Yes.
John McLarty: His nature qualities.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. And we know what this looks like because Romans 5:7 and 8 says, God demonstrates his own love toward us in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. That is selfless, dying love to redeem and reconcile a desperate fallen human race, each one of us.
John McLarty: And we weren’t just sinning against each other. We’re sinning against God.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. That’s right.
John McLarty: And while we were yet sinners against God, he died for us.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. And so the father gives us this remarkable invitation to come to him and be reconciled to him. And the moment we receive the gift of salvation, this permanent and glorious change happens to our identity. And that’s in Romans 8:15, which I love. It says, for you did not receive the spirit of bondage, again to fear, but received the spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, Abba, father. Do you know what Abba means there?
John McLarty: I don’t.
Kimberly Faith: It’s Aramaic for papa.
John McLarty: Papa.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah.
John McLarty: Okay.
Kimberly Faith: Or daddy.
John McLarty: Like, yeah. Very affectionate term.
Kimberly Faith: Very affectionate, very intimate term. And in fact, it’s the term
John McLarty: And, you know, not fearful.
Kimberly Faith: Not fearful. Right. It’s the same term that Jesus himself used in the Garden Of Gethsemane when he was in the darkest moment of his life. I think that’s recorded in Mark 14:36. So we need to have the right view. If we want to understand this great invitation that God gives us, we need to have the right view of the father. We’re not being drawn to some ogre or some person who’s
John McLarty: Task master.
Kimberly Faith: Demanding a certain standard before we can actually be invited. No. This is the father who gave his son. This is the father of the prodigal son. You know, the one that while he, he spotted his child way down the road in Luke Chapter 15, broke into a
John McLarty: Good example.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Arms wide open, tears, dignity completely set aside, and embraced his son. That’s the father who invites us.
John McLarty: The father of the prodigal son.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. And so, you know, again, I have struggled with my view of the heavenly father for what because we’re just so broken, right? And I’m sure that lots of people listening to this have also struggled, but we have to be intentional about healing that view in
John McLarty: Yeah.
Kimberly Faith: From God’s word. You know, these verses that we’ve read, if we believe that this is what God says and that he is truthful, this can heal our view of God, the father.
John McLarty: Yeah. And that’s very important. That’s, I mean, I’ve struggled with that. And I had a great father on earth. But, you know, I don’t know if it’s the world culture or just this bad rap that, you know, the father gets.
Kimberly Faith: Right. Well, especially in our culture today.
John McLarty: You know that he’s just waiting for you to go off course so he can, you know, kind of slap you back or
Kimberly Faith: Right. Right.
John McLarty: You know, that’s just a conception we have.
Kimberly Faith: I tell you
John McLarty: And I’ve had to you know, I’d say maybe the first, I’ve been saved fifty years, maybe the first twenty years, half of my Christian life, I was kind of that somewhat, you know, oh, I bet we better walk straight or we’ll
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: So I’ve grown in that.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah.
John McLarty: The heavenly father’s unconditionally loving. Not that there’s never chastening.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: But it’s always for our good.
Kimberly Faith: Well, we, you know, when my son would get out of line, he needed to do some chastening, you know? He would have ended up worthless if he had
John McLarty: But you did it in love. Right Kim.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. Because I loved him. Now there were times I was close to the other line. You know, just a real quick aside before we jump onto the next segment about the son. One of the best movies I ever watched, and I’m not going to say it’s 100% doctrinally true, but it’s The Shack or read the book.
John McLarty: I’ve seen it.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah.
John McLarty: Great movie.
Kimberly Faith: Just a great, great movie. And it’s very interesting that the father is portrayed in the movie as this, you know, this real friendly, big, robust black woman who just, son, you know, she’s just kind of giving him the down home invitation because he needed to see that in that time of his life before he was ready to see
John McLarty: Yeah.
Kimberly Faith: The second manifestation of the father, which was the Native American, more stern, you know, pragmatic. And it’s very, again, it really helped me with, it was one of those things that helped me refocus on understanding more of who the father is in a way that I could understand it, if that makes sense.
John McLarty: A loving father that sometimes has to just talk straight with us.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right.
John McLarty: But loves us through it all.
Kimberly Faith: Well, actually, one of the most hilarious lines in that movie is when he comes up from, you know, he’d been out playing with Jesus in the water, and she’s on the porch in a rocking chair with her sunglasses on, sitting in the sun. And he says, well, I guess God hasn’t got much to do today. And she’s like, son, you have no idea what I’ve been doing all day behind these sunglasses. I feel like God sometimes does that to me, like, what are you doing right now? Who do you think you are? Anyway, that’s off topic a little bit. But the next segment is the son’s invitation. And we talked about this quite a bit in the incarnation of Jesus podcast. But the invitation that he gives us is in Romans 8:16-17, which basically says the spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are the children of God. And if children, then heirs, heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ.
John McLarty: That’s great.
Kimberly Faith: So this invitation that Jesus gives us is I will make you my joint heir. I don’t even think we can fathom that, really.
John McLarty: Yeah. Think of being made, just think of some rich famous person that invites you to be their heir.
Kimberly Faith: Right. Right.
John McLarty: And this is God inviting us.
Kimberly Faith: And wealth we can’t even imagine.
John McLarty: Yeah.
Kimberly Faith: You know, we think of wealth in terms of gold, silver, you know, nice houses. But we’re not taking any of that with us. You know, the wealth, think about, when I started kind of coming to an age in my life where I was thinking, what’s important? It really, when this is just secular thinking, it really wasn’t even money as much as possessions as much as my health. This is not that money can really, I mean, you can try, but when your health, when you get cancer, you get cancer. You can’t control that.
John McLarty: I have come to that conclusion. There are some health issues that money can resolve
Kimberly Faith: That’s right.
John McLarty: And there are some that no amount of money will resolve.
Kimberly Faith: And it doesn’t matter how famous you are, how wealthy you are, if you got stage four cancer, good chance you’re going. But then as the Lord has kind of shifted my perspective, I found that my most precious possessions come from the presence of God. The riches of peace, the riches of satisfaction and joy, the riches of experiencing his love. That’s a great shift to have happen. I’m not saying I’m perfect or arrived. I’m just saying I’ve noticed that shift where when the Son says, I’ll make you my joint heir, we are joint heirs of the eternal treasures. And
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: There’s only one currency we’re taking with us, and that’s the souls of people.
John McLarty: Souls of, I was thinking that same thought.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah.
John McLarty: And kind of as a part of that, the souls of people and then encouraging the fellow warriors that are involved in that battle for the souls of people.
Kimberly Faith: That camaraderie.
John McLarty: Yeah.
Kimberly Faith: It’s a great, you know, I was never in the military. I have a lot of military friends, a lot of military clients, family. Obviously, my son’s in the military. And, you know, you see that camaraderie. I mostly experienced it in sports, you know, where we would just, you know, play in a tournament all day and just be, you know, in with each other and just it was a great time. And there’s nothing worse than having a team that fights, you know, that’s fighting against each other.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: But there’s nothing better than having a team that fights together. And I think, you know, when we think about Jesus, he came and entered into our situation in a way that we can’t even wrap our minds around. You know, we talked a lot about how he became incarnate. All the things, 13 exhibits about what that meant in an earlier podcast, and how it’s just mind blowing that he humbled himself and took upon the form of a bond servant just like us.
John McLarty: What he gave up and experienced for us to be able to offer the invitation. The price had to be paid.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. That’s right. And it’s, you know, and we think about that, the idea that he has, he desires. He did all. He gave all that up so that we could actually take part of his inheritance, you know. That’s again, going back to the basic nature of God being love, justice, and righteousness, but love being this predominant thing. You think about that love that gives with that expectation of receiving. That’s what Jesus represents. He’s not making us a joint heir because he’s going to get something from us. We don’t have anything to offer him. It’s complete selflessness.
John McLarty: Complete selflessness, grace, sharing.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. And you think about that, you know, this should be our undoing, really. Just the sacrifice that Jesus made, not just so we could be on the fringes, but so we could be all up in it. We could be part of the family. We’re in the family. We’re a full heir. You know, we’re, you know, I do a lot of estate planning for people, and it always amazes me when I have a couple that’s been you know, they maybe have their second marriage, and there’s no hesitation that the step kids should get the same inheritance as the bio kids. You know, that just shows that bond, you know? And there’s no need, like, to put in safety measures so that that happens if the biological parent dies, you know, the step parent’s still going to treat those kids, you can just kind of tell.
John McLarty: Yeah.
Kimberly Faith: You know? But that’s
John McLarty: No questions asked.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. That’s right.
John McLarty: They’re joint heirs.
Kimberly Faith: So that’s the son’s invitation to make us joint heirs, sharing his inheritance. And then we have the holy spirit’s invitation. Now we did a podcast about this, and I’ll tell you about the spirit’s invitation to intercede in our prayers, transform us, and guide us. You know, I think that the holy spirit kind of has this reputation in today’s culture, Christian culture, as just the person who comes in and makes people speak in tongues, you know. I’m not going to comment on that. On one hand, I’m sure that English is not God’s first language. On the other hand, I’m not a big proponent of, I’ve never spoken in tongues. Doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen. I’m really this isn’t what this is about. But I think the greater, Paul said when he talked about the gifts, he talked about tongues not being real high on the list, if I’m remembering the scripture correctly.
John McLarty: Right. But the greatest gift is love.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right.
John McLarty: Yep.
Kimberly Faith: And right. It’s First Corinthians 13.
John McLarty: And that was after a discussion of all these various
Kimberly Faith: Yes.
John McLarty: Gifts they were experiencing.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. A prophecy, all these gifts. And so the holy spirit’s greatest function in our life is he intercedes in our prayers, he transforms us, and he guides us. And we did a whole podcast on that, which is, I still go back and listen to that. I don’t like, you know, we do these because we’re just trying to remember what God taught us.
John McLarty: Yeah. We did a great, I mean, because it stimulated, made us do a bunch of studying and
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: Ponder it. That’s why I’m not saying we did something great, but it’s a great topic. It’s the role of the holy spirit.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right.
John McLarty: Old testament and New testament.
Kimberly Faith: Right. The invitation of the holy spirit and
John McLarty: The drawing.
Kimberly Faith: And then the withdrawing.
John McLarty: And the presence.
Kimberly Faith: Right. Right. But it’s, yeah. Because we did this whole study on how in the Old Testament, they did not have the, everybody didn’t have the holy spirit. And matter of fact, they could lose it because we went through a whole series of verses about that. But now
John McLarty: Losing the sense of the presence of it.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. That’s right.
John McLarty: Different offices.
Kimberly Faith: Exactly. But then there’s this promise of Jesus and when he, in John Chapter 14 you want to read John 14:16 and 17?
John McLarty: Yeah. And I will pray the father, and he will give you another helper that he may abide with you forever, the spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive because it neither sees him nor knows him, but you know him for he dwells with you and be will be in you.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. It’s so interesting because that word for another helper is the Greek word, allos which means another of the exact same kind, not just a substitute for Jesus. It’s the personal presence of God.
John McLarty: Interesting.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah.
John McLarty: All are God. Holy, the holy spirit, the son, and the father.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: And that’s so fascinating. They have a relationship, and they want us to draw us into that relationship.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. They invite us.
John McLarty: And then something else that I think that’s key, Kim, is then the relationship we have as Christians. I don’t think it is just an afterthought.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: I think we are meant to show that relationship among the brethren, a special relationship.
Kimberly Faith: Absolutely.
John McLarty: Can you imagine yourself just getting saved and going off and becoming a hermit in a log cabin?
Kimberly Faith: No.
John McLarty: And even though it’s just, you know, there’s you and God and the Bible, but I actually experienced that before. I ended up at our cabin in Colorado alone for three days. Or, I actually had to stay there a week. But we had had this big crowd and, you know, it’s just events and crafts and devotions, and everybody left. And after about three days, I thought, oh, this is not going to be so wonderful. I thought, this isn’t what my life is all about.
Kimberly Faith: Right. Right.
John McLarty: Just sitting around, you know? We’re kind of built for relationships. It’s interesting that God, we’re studying this, God has this relationship within himself.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: Father, son, and holy ghost.
Kimberly Faith: Right. And I’m sure it’s far more beautiful and intricate than we can even conjure up in our little human minds. But thankfully, God’s word gives us all these examples and verses that we can look at. And I think it’s worth noting too, even though we did a lot of detail about this in Come Meet the Holy Spirit podcast, that he intercedes for us, which means that when we’re too broken, too overwhelmed to find words like in prayer, there’s times when like, we were praying this morning for some people, and and I felt the need to just ask the Holy Spirit to intercede in my prayer. How do I pray for this person? And you want to read Romans 8:26-27? I just love these verses.
John McLarty: Sure. I love that verse too. Likewise, the spirit also helps in our weaknesses for we do not know what we should pray for as we ought. But the spirit himself makes intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. That’s amazing.
John McLarty: Yeah. We don’t even know what to pray for except we might just cry out. We know we need to pray.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Well, we know we need to pray.
John McLarty: The holy spirit picks it up.
Kimberly Faith: You know, sometimes, you know, when I’ve kind of expressed this to people, what does that look like? Literally, what it looks like is, spirit, I do not know how to pray for this person because I don’t know enough about them to know what they need right now. So I’m going to ask you to give me your words
John McLarty: Yeah.
Kimberly Faith: It’s almost like I think about arrows in the hands of a really great warrior. When that arrow is being guided by a foresight that is beyond the physical eyesight of that warrior, like a missile, right? You know, you’ve got so much more effectiveness from that arrow. And that’s when, I mean, everybody, I’m sure, would pray this differently, but my prayer is just holy spirit, help me to know how to pray. And you know what’s interesting? A lot of times, he’ll bring to mind God’s word, the word. Like this particular person I was praying for this morning, the word that came to me was, Lord, show them your goodness, which will lead them to repentance. Because we know the verse, the goodness of God leads us to repentance, right? So it’s so important that part of this great invitation that we have is to become a powerful prayer warrior through the intercession of the Holy Spirit. But then he also transforms us. You know, I kind of like to look at this like he gets us ready to really enjoy the dance and really be effective in the dance. It’s important to understand this is not reformation. This is not me reforming myself. But this is the spirit transforming us from the inside out because our soul is made in Christ. And what comes out, what people see in our flesh is affected by this transforming power in our soul.
John McLarty: It brings out the, it produces the fruit of the spirit.
Kimberly Faith: Right. Why don’t you read Galatians Five?
John McLarty: And we all we would all love to see more of this
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: In our lives and the world.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: The fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, long suffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self control.
Kimberly Faith: I mean, if all those things existed in our life, we would be so different than everyone around us.
John McLarty: To use the dance analogy, he’s showing us the dance steps.
Kimberly Faith: Oh, that’s really good.
John McLarty: You like that, Kim?
Kimberly Faith: I love that. That’s perfect, dad. And so he, like he guides our steps. And,you know, that kind of goes into the third element of what the holy spirit does, and that is he shows us the steps like you just said, then he guides our steps. This is one of my favorite verses out of Isaiah. It says, your ears shall hear a word behind you saying, this is the way. Walk in it. Wherever you turn to the right hand or whenever you turn to the left. You know, I think that’s what I want to hear, you know?
John McLarty: And the spirit God wants to show us.
Kimberly Faith: He does.
John McLarty: He doesn’t want to hide the path from us.
Kimberly Faith: Right. He’s not hiding the ball.
John McLarty: No. He wants to show us the steps. Show us the way.
Kimberly Faith: So, you know, think about this. No wallflowers ever been treated like this. Okay? The spirit of God, the son of God, the father, they do all these things in order to draw us into this great dance. And it’s not just a few people. It’s not just a few people that have been invited. You’re listening to this podcast. You have been invited. You know, we know this, we’ve done multiple podcasts on salvation, the Old Testament and the New Testament. We’ll probably do another one. Because it’s such an important thing to understand that Abraham believed God, David believed God the same way you and I believe God for salvation. And even Job, you know, I love this, well, let’s read some of these verses from the Old Testament. I think it’s just really worth reading. Like, for example, how Isaiah heard the father calling out centuries before Jesus died. Do you want to read Isaiah?
John McLarty: I’m just looking at it here. It’s just, I’ve always loved this verse. It’s the idea of, you know, Jesus said, I’m the living water.
Kimberly Faith: Uh-huh.
John McLarty: Here’s Isaiah, many years before Jesus spoke those words, ho, everyone who thirsts, come to the waters. And you have no money, come buy and eat. Yes. Come buy wine and milk without money and without price. So by grace. Why do you spend money for what is not bread and your wages for what does not satisfy? Listen carefully to me and eat what is good and let your soul delight itself in abundance. Incline your ear and come to me. Here, and your soul shall live.
Kimberly Faith: Love that.
John McLarty: Wow. That’s the gospel in the Old Testament.
Kimberly Faith: That’s the gospel. And then Job says, I know my redeemer lives, present tense, And he shall stand at the last on the earth. And after my skin is destroyed, this I know that in my flesh, I shall see God.
John McLarty: Resurrection.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. The resurrection.
John McLarty: And redeemer.
Kimberly Faith: Yes.
John McLarty: The word redeem. Buy back.
Kimberly Faith: Yes. And so we have this invitation, that everyone is invited. Revelations 22:17 said, the spirit and the bride say, come. And let him who hears, say, come. And let him who thirsts, come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.
John McLarty: Perfect. Whosoever will may come.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. I mean, there’s just, there’s so many verses in the bible that we could
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: We could talk about this. But
John McLarty: For God so loved the world.
Kimberly Faith: That whosoever.
John McLarty: Yeah.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Yeah. So this, this invitation to the great, you know, the great dance, the great relationship with the father, the son, and the holy spirit is for every person from across every era of history, from every background, it doesn’t matter what failure, what wounds you have, how bad you think you’ve sinned, Jesus died for it all. The spirit draws us, and the father wants us to be his son and daughter. And today, if you haven’t received Jesus Christ as your Lord and savior, and you’re hearing these words, guess what? The door is still open.
John McLarty: Here’s Revelations 3:20. Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone, look at that, anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him and he with me. Revelations 3:20.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. It’s, this kind of
John McLarty: It’s a perfect hundredth podcast.
Kimberly Faith: It is.
John McLarty: The great dance relationship, and all are invited.
Kimberly Faith: You know, the thing is, we have to remember that God isn’t standing at the door here that you just read about with a ledger.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: Saying, well, you don’t really measure up. So, you know, you’ve got this big list of failures.
John McLarty: I’m holding the door closed unless you push real hard.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Yeah. I remember, you know, when I got saved, I remember the problem that I, the reason I had never truly been saved before is because my salvation prayer was along the lines of, Lord, I believe you can save me. I know I need you to be to save me. So save me and I’ll be good.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith:That and I’ll be good was the reason I didn’t get saved.
John McLarty: Exactly.
Kimberly Faith: Because I was using my good works as part of the qualifier
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: To qualify myself.
John McLarty: Inserting good works.
Kimberly Faith: Right. And we talked about this a lot in the attitudes of Christ series about the beatitudes. How the first beatitude, blessed are the poor in spirit, right? It’s only those who know they’re completely bankrupt before God who can be saved.
John McLarty: Amen.
Kimberly Faith: And the same applies to Christian, the Christian walk. It’s only when we recognize that we are nothing without God that we can actually glorify him.
John McLarty: And even the spirit of God when he’s drawing us shows us that we’re bankrupt.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah.
John McLarty: It’s not necessarily that we figure it out ourselves.
Kimberly Faith: Repentance is a gift.
John McLarty: Yes. Yeah. Repentance is a gift.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. And so, you know, if you’re listening to this and you have never received Jesus Christ as your savior, you know, well, the father is, he wants to adopt you. The son gave everything to give you part of his inheritance. And look, all of us were his enemy. All of us have been his enemy before salvation because we have committed the crime called sin against his love. And it doesn’t matter how big or small. It doesn’t, you don’t have to murder somebody to have committed enough sin to go to hell, you know? Sin is basically a violation of the love of God that kills us spiritually. Our soul and spirit die because the wages of sin is death. That’s right out of the Bible. I didn’t make that up.
John McLarty: And sin is selfishness.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right.
John McLarty: Self centeredness.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right.
John McLarty: Yep.
Kimberly Faith: It’s saying,I know this is what God says, but I
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: Am going to eat the fruit.
John McLarty: I will.
Kimberly Faith: I will eat the fruit because I want to be like God. Because I know better than God. So however measured up, it just takes one. Just like, you know, you get one chance at life. Once you draw your last breath, you don’t get to come back, barring some miracle. Sin kills our soul and spirit. And the only way to revive a dead person is with help from the outside.
John McLarty: Amen.
Kimberly Faith: And so this is
John McLarty: Spiritual life.
Kimberly Faith: That’s right. And that’s why the holy spirit has to draw us.
John McLarty: Right.
Kimberly Faith: He’s the power from the outside that intercedes even in our salvation. And if you’re listening to this podcast, and you don’t know if you’ve been born again, well, this is the time. Today is the day of salvation. There’s no knocking at the pearly gates and hoping Saint Peter will let you in and give you a second chance. That’s nowhere in the Bible. It is appointed unto man once to die and then the judgment. That’s exactly what the Bible says. I can’t give you the actual citation on that, but it’s right in the Bible. But the good news is that God has given us an invitation, a priceless personal extravagant invitation to enter into a relationship that is so much better than anything, any other relationship on this earth. And so I would just encourage you, if you’ve never experienced this relationship, it is much like an amazing ballroom dance. I mean, that’s a terrible way to, it’s not even a good enough explanation, really.
John McLarty: And I’m glad you said that. The Christian life is not this dull, boring, you know
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: You just get set off in a room somewhere. We’re being invited to the great adventure.
Kimberly Faith: It is such a great adventure.
John McLarty: The work of God.
Kimberly Faith: It is a work, it’s like, you know, you think of I like to think of what I believe were my greatest accomplishments. If I go back, I think graduating from law school was a great accomplishment. Passing a couple bar exams, great accomplishment. Having healthy children, you know, watching my children accomplish things, building my own business. Those secular accomplishments gave me how much satisfaction?
John McLarty: Zero.
Kimberly Faith: I mean, maybe for a minute?
John McLarty: Actually maybe negative.
Kimberly Faith: Maybe. Yeah. Well, there were
John McLarty: Like, I’m missing something.
Kimberly Faith: Well, you build it up
John McLarty: Negative.
Kimberly Faith: You build it up as if it’s going to be the great satisfying purpose, then it tanks and then you’re looking for more. But that’s so different than what a relationship with God gives us, is this perpetual satisfying purpose that never gets old. And then what’s interesting is when, you know, when I’ve led somebody to Christ, that’s a mountaintop experience.
John McLarty: Amen.
Kimberly Faith: And even though that experience in my body fades somewhat, when I go back and think about it, it’s like it’s born all over again. And what’s even, we talked about this in the gifts of Christmas series last year in 2025, how those eternal gifts are going to be relived all over again someday in eternity.
John McLarty: Amen.
Kimberly Faith: And so this is just, I’m so glad that the holy spirit, you know, prompted this podcast for our one hundredth podcast because it’s so exciting to be in the great dance with God.
John McLarty: Well, and just the connection of the all three, the father wants to adopt us.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: The son paid the price and wants to make us join heirs. And the spirit draws us and then wants to come inside of us, dwell with us, intercede, transform, and guide us.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: Who could say no to that?
Kimberly Faith: And who else is going to give us that invitation, right?
John McLarty: Exactly. Who has the power to give us that invitation.
Kimberly Faith: Nobody, no person, no relationship on earth, no child, no husband, no wife, no father, no mother, no grandparent who can give us this invitation at this level.
John McLarty: So we basically just kind of acknowledge we’re sinners. We yield to the holy spirit. We say yes to God. You know, take my life knowing that Jesus paid the price.
Kimberly Faith: Right.
John McLarty: Ask him with full confidence that he’s able to perform what he’s promised to do.
Kimberly Faith: Yes.
John McLarty: And, you know, turn our life over to him.
Kimberly Faith: Yes.
John McLarty: That repentance which he gives us, but we yield to it.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah.
John McLarty: And then boom. All this comes to play.
Kimberly Faith: I love that you said that, you used the word trust. I think about when I was in undergraduate school, I took ballroom dancing. And I remember, one of the instructors, the instructor brought in a really great male ballroom dancer. And we’d know, of course, the students, we’ve been practicing with each other. We were terrible. But I remember this guy we got to dance with this guy once. And I remember him taking my hand, leading me on the dance floor. All I had to do was follow and I looked really good. I felt really good. I felt like I could dance because he was leading.
John McLarty: Amen.
Kimberly Faith: And I think when, I love that
John McLarty: I love that.
Kimberly Faith: Analogy because that’s how I feel like my life is when I am letting the holy spirit guide me.
John McLarty: Amen.
Kimberly Faith: When I am completely surrendered to his lead. It’s like, wow. And it’s not even about me at this point. I know it’s about him because he’s leading. And what people see is something beautiful that is all God.
John McLarty: And it fulfills us. And I’m just thinking we’re, you know, part of this was being accepted. We’re accepted in the beloved.
Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Yeah.
John McLarty: We’re invited. We’re accepted. We’re brought in. When we say yes to God.
Kimberly Faith: So you don’t have to live as a wallflower dad.
John McLarty: Amen.
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