Episode 70: Eternal Security: 5 Misinterpreted Scriptures

Jacob Paul: Welcome to the truth and love podcast with your hosts Kimberly Faith and John Mack. The truth and love podcast seeks to present God’s timeless truth through the lens of his remarkable love. So last week, we were explaining that there are seven reasons why, according to the Bible, a truly born again believer cannot lose their salvation. And, you know, we talked about this a lot last week was how that is such a peaceful thought and concept.

John McLarty: Right. The eternal security that gives us peace and is just the biblical truth, but for by grace are you saved through faith. Right. Not of ourselves.

Kimberly Faith: Right.

John McLarty: It’s the gift of God. But and then we have everlasting life. Yeah. We presently possess everlasting life the minute we’re the second we’re born again.

Kimberly Faith: And and how that really the idea or the concept of eternal security, really, it really glorifies the nature of God.

John McLarty: It does.

Kimberly Faith: And to say it’s not true impugns the nature of God. It does. And so today’s today we’re gonna focus on some of these hard passages because, well, we’ve picked out five.

John McLarty: Let’s do.

Kimberly Faith: Yeah. And these passages have been used over and over and over again in discussions I’ve had with people, I’m sure with you too, to say, this means you can lose your salvation. So we’re just gonna jump right in because, you know, it really and you you think about it, context is important. And and we have to compare scripture with scripture. You can’t isolate a verse.

You can isolate any verse and make it say whatever you want to, but we have to interpret the scripture in light of God’s nature and what he says about himself because he is the foundation. He is the word. And the context of who was written to, you know, what was going on. And anybody who’s done any, you know, has lived any length of time knows you have to look at the context of things.

John McLarty: That’s a great point. And not only the context of where it is in the scriptures, who it’s to, but in the context of these concepts of eternal security and being born again. And that leaning toward, if we have everlasting life, how can you lose it?

Kimberly Faith: Right. Yeah. And so let’s just jump in with the first scripture, which is Hebrews six:four-six. Do you wanna read that?

John McLarty: Sure. I’m very familiar with this. We teach this a lot. For it is impossible for those who are once enlightened and have tasted the heavenly gift and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God and put him to an open shame.

Kimberly Faith: I mean, you could see how somebody could read that and say, oh, it looks like, you know, this is a person who’s lost their salvation.

John McLarty: Sure. They fall away. Yeah. And they can’t be renewed again, again to repentance.

Kimberly Faith: Right.

John McLarty: And they’re crucifying to themselves the son of God and putting him to an open shame.

Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Yeah. So we have to read this in context. So first of all, the context is it’s written to believers, right?

John McLarty: And that’s very important. Yeah. So this was in Hebrews six, but in Hebrews five at the end of it, it’s talking to believers. And Paul is actually scolding these Christians and saying, For when you ought to be teachers, you have need that one teach you again, and that you’re in need of milk and not of strong meat. And he’s scolding them for not growing.

So that’s the context here. It’s Christians that are not growing. They’re not being discipled.

Kimberly Faith: Right. So that’s the foundation for this warning.

John McLarty: Right.

Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Because the writer of Hebrews is pleading with these believers to go on to perfection. In other words, grow up in your faith. And, you know, and he’s and he’s really painting a sobering picture for believers. Like, you’re, you know, you’re becoming spiritually useless if you refuse to grow.

John McLarty: Right. And this is a key verse in verse chapter six. He’s telling them, just like he said, to go on. We don’t need to be babes in Christ. We need to be growing.

But then he says, and this we will do, that is grow, if God permit. So that’s talking about even the Christian life needs repentance. Yeah. God permit is God allows. Right.

So even to be saved.

Kimberly Faith: Right.

John McLarty: We needed God’s repentance. We don’t have the proper desires to be saved. God gave us faith and repentance. So this is saying even the Christian life is that God’s pleasure, so to speak, that he’s given us, he’s renewing our repentance. And that’s what is repentance?

Just the desire to follow him Right. To turn from the flesh and follow him. Yes. So it’s kinda like if we bow up against God, to use maybe an Arkansas term, bowing up against somebody, stiffing our necks, and say, I’m not going that way. Yeah.

And God this is the is the warning. Yes. Like, okay, if you do this, if you don’t go on into growth, God may

Kimberly Faith: But let you he doesn’t and the important thing to me is, again, looking at context, it’s I’ll use the example of how, you know, we talked about adoption. Right? Mhmm. You know, if if if you are if I’m living in your house and I’ve been adopted by you, you know, or I can take even one of my kids, you know, one of my children is living under my roof and they’re a teenager and they refuse to follow the rules, you know, they’re gonna lose a lot of blessings.

John McLarty: That’s a great point.

Kimberly Faith: But they’re still my kid.

John McLarty: Right.

Kimberly Faith: You know, it’s not, you know, just like, it’s not because I’m a rebellious doesn’t mean it undoes the adoption decree that the judge entered. Right? Just because a child is rebellious does not mean that they lose their genetics in my family. They are gonna lose a lot of blessings. Or if you have an adult child who, you know, wants to come into your house and violate your love, violate your rules, you know, trash it, take everything that’s precious to you and just, you know, trash it or stomp on it or whatever, you know, desecrate the things that you hold precious.

Well, you’re not gonna have a close relationship with that child. They’re they have they have chosen to go astray, basically. And without repentance, that and reconciliation, that relationship is going to suffer. And they’re they’re gonna they’re gonna be the ones who suffer. And, again, that’s a very poor example because we are not God, you know, but we can understand that.

John McLarty: Right. So they won’t become your un child.

Kimberly Faith: Right. Exactly.

John McLarty: But they and become, in disfavor.

Kimberly Faith: Yes. And and it’s really And they

John McLarty: can lose blessings.

Kimberly Faith: That’s right.

John McLarty: They will lose blessings.

Kimberly Faith: Why don’t you look up first Thessalonians five nineteen? Because this this we just talked about Christians who continually resist conviction, taking God’s grace for granted or neglect these spiritual disciplines that we’re we’re the attitudes of Christ that we’re supposed to be exercising. We can we can become calloused to the drawing of the holy spirit because nothing that we do for God’s glory is done except by believing the holy spirit. Oh, sorry. Five nineteen.

John McLarty: Okay. Yeah. Not there yet. Oh, there it is.

Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Go ahead and read that.

John McLarty: Oh, first first Thessalonians five nineteen Uh-huh. Where it says, quench not the spirit. Right. Yeah. And or, you know, there’s a I think another verse that says, grieve not the spirit of God.

Right. So we can, as Christians, do that.

Kimberly Faith: And

John McLarty: this is kind of the warning that you, evidently, you can get to a place where you’ve done that so often and rejected God, you don’t lose your salvation, because you gotta go back to the judgment seat of Christ in Corinthians, but he himself shall be saved, but you can lose the blessings.

Kimberly Faith: It’s it’s, you know, it’s kinda like I I like to use this example just because I can’t even imagine doing this, but I think everybody can visualize it. If, you know, if I came to visit you and mom and every time I came to visit you, I just punched you in the face, you know, every time. You know, I’m pretty sure after a while you’d be saying, you know, I’m either gonna wear a really great body bomber when they come to visit or you probably just stay outside, you know, and that we would it would break fellowship. And there will be a time when when we would probably part ways if I couldn’t change my behavior. But our sin is a punch in the face to God.

John McLarty: Right. And I I just think about when you come to visit, Lynn and I love that. Yeah. What if you were just

Kimberly Faith: Me too.

John McLarty: What if you were just absolutely contrary to everything we believed and you just showed up in these terrible conditions and there just wouldn’t Wouldn’t

Kimberly Faith: be the

John McLarty: same fellowship. Yeah. We would really both be losing.

Kimberly Faith: Yes. Yes. And I think, again, we have to also this, you know, this this passage in Hebrews, we have to go back to the seven fundamentals we talked about in the last podcast. If we use this as a premise, this is talking to believers, and believers are people who have been born again or in Christ. And we we look back to the foundation that we laid last week on all the reasons that salvation cannot be lost.

And this these verses make complete sense that we’re talking about the relationship and the loss of blessings, not the loss of salvation. So let’s talk about the second one, which is Hebrews ten twenty six and twenty seven.

John McLarty: Okay. These are all interesting verses, and they challenge us. Yeah. So Hebrews ten twenty six and twenty seven, For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a certain fearful expectation of judgment and fiery indignation, will devour the adversaries. Interesting.

So to me, this is Hebrews six, as you can experience this, that warning in your life where you’re not renewed again to repent. So you lose that freshness with God. Right. And just think about our lives. Yeah.

We need God’s refreshing. Yes. As Christians, kinda continually.

Kimberly Faith: Yeah, we do.

John McLarty: But what if, you know, in the Hebrews six, you get to the point where God just quits refreshing you?

Kimberly Faith: Well, I think you brought up a good point because really there’s two loss of blessings. You know, there’s one while we’re here.

John McLarty: Right.

Kimberly Faith: And there’s the one when we stand, when believers stand, this fearful expectation on judgment does not refer to the great white throne judgment of unbelievers in Revelation 20, but like you said, it points to the judgment seat of Christ in second Corinthians five ten and Romans 14, where every believer is gonna Not give account for the for salvation, that’s already sealed, but for the loss of reward that we could have had, had we lived our life according to God’s purpose for our life. And so really when we’re talking about if we sin willfully after, and this again is written to Christians, There no longer remains a sacrifice for sin, but a in other words, when we say there no longer remains a sacrifice for sin, we’re talking about a Christian who lives in in awe and wonder of God understands that there was a great sacrifice made so that they could live in the peace of But that is replaced in our life, and this is speaking to our life right now. Right? And it’s replaced with a certain fearful expectation of judgment. Okay?

And because God’s fire is gonna refine. We talk about the refining fire of God that we read about it before and talked about it. God’s fire not only refines the Christian works that are done to see what the motivation is. The motivation done for God’s glory or for our own personal gain. Whatever was done for our own personal gain is gonna be burned up in the fire of God.

And as he refines our works and whatever’s left after it is purged by the fire is what we’re going to have as a reward. On the others, for non believers, their works are going to be measured and are always going to fail because the Bible is very clear that we can’t work our way to heaven. So this again, in Hebrews chapter 10, we’re talking about Christians and what happens to them here and in the hereafter when they have chosen or, you know, and I’ve been this, I’m not saying they as if I’ve never done but when we choose to live as a born again believer in the world according to the enemy’s plan.

John McLarty: Right, and we have a whole podcast on the judgment seat of Christ and it talks about in that judgment, for we are not for our salvation, so we can receive reward or loss, but it says, but he himself shall be saved yet by his

Kimberly Faith: fire. Exactly.

John McLarty: Yeah. And so that’s this fearful expectation.

Kimberly Faith: Right.

John McLarty: So these passages kind of go together. One is misery in this life for a Christian not serving. It’s Hebrews, and then the first passage in Hebrews, and then this one, this fearful expectation. As a Christian, you would kind of have this idea things aren’t going to go well at the judgment seat of Christ.

Kimberly Faith: Right.

John McLarty: We have that inward, innate knowledge.

Kimberly Faith: Well, it is that what should be an expectation is turned to dread.

John McLarty: Right.

Kimberly Faith: And it’s kinda like, you know, we Maybe we work really hard to prepare a nice meal for our family and we have this expectation that they’re really going to enjoy it, right? Especially if we are supposed to be preparing the meal, it’s kinda like, well, it’s kinda like, if I was supposed to prepare the Thanksgiving meal and I just was lazy and didn’t do it, I’m gonna have a dread when everybody shows up and they’re gonna be all mad, right? But if I did what I was supposed to do, I’m gonna be excited. I remember being in law school and sometimes there would just be so much homework that I just wouldn’t do it all because I just was overwhelmed. And I would go to class with a very dreadful

John McLarty: That’s a good thought.

Kimberly Faith: And thinking, oh man, I know the professor’s gonna call

John McLarty: on A fearful expectation of judgment.

Kimberly Faith: Yes, yes, and ridicule. But when I was prepared, I would go thinking, I hope he calls on me. And this is what this Hebrews passage is talking about, that we make choices every day. But when you go down the road so far and sin willfully over and over and over again, I mean, it’s like the punch in the face. How much does God have to take before he says, okay, go.

John McLarty: You know, I think of that verse, I’m gonna paraphrase it, but Jesus says, if you’re ashamed of me on earth, I’ll be ashamed of you in heaven. Right, right. And can you imagine, that’s a fearful expectation to me. Can you imagine being saved and you go to meet Christ because once saved, always saved. But you’ve fallen back into your entire life, you’re never renewed again under repentance.

Kimberly Faith: And

John McLarty: you meet Jesus and he says, you’re my child, but I’m really disappointed with how you lived your life.

Kimberly Faith: Yeah. I gave everything for you.

John McLarty: Yeah. What, why? And there are all these people you could have

Kimberly Faith: reached. Right.

John McLarty: There are all these things you could have done and blessed so many people, but you went back to your own, you know, lifestyle, your own wellness.

Kimberly Faith: Selfish life. Yep. I think about, you know, fighting the war and being in the trenches with people, and then you’ve got one person who’s over there fraternizing with the enemy. And basically people are dying because you’re fraternizing with the enemy instead of fighting with And the it’s just that that is, it’s such a traitorship. So is that a word, traitorship?

John McLarty: We’ll make one.

Kimberly Faith: I’m not even.

John McLarty: We’ll add it to our Urban Dictionary. The Kim Urban Dictionary.

Kimberly Faith: So let’s do, let’s go to the third verse, which is in Galatians five:four. And it says, You have become estranged from Christ. You who attempt to be justified by the law, you have fallen from grace.

John McLarty: People that use this to say you can lose your salvation is so out of context because Paul is talking about the Galatians. Their problem was they’re falling back under the law.

Kimberly Faith: These are Jews.

John McLarty: Yeah, but they were saved. Yeah. But then they’re like, well, okay, we’re saved by grace through the work of Jesus on the cross, but we better keep the law too, to keep our salvation. And Paul’s scolding them for that. And he’s saying, if you attempt, if you fall back under the law to think you’re keeping your salvation, not only is that an insult to Christ, but you’ve fallen from grace.

You’ve fallen from that peace that grace gives you. It’s not like you’ve nowhere does that even imply, really, you’ve lost your salvation. Right. But you’ve fallen from this status or this peace, the peace that grace brings.

Kimberly Faith: Right. Yeah. I mean, and I can’t remember what the but it seemed like the churches and the believers in Galatia were being swayed by Judaizers.

John McLarty: Judaizers, yeah.

Kimberly Faith: Which are people, Christians, who were saying, you have to be circumcised, you have to do these, all the things that they were doing before they got saved, Right. That was, they had to do that because salvation by grace through faith was insufficient. They were combining these works and grace, which is a lot of problems in religions today.

John McLarty: This

Kimberly Faith: is an isolated this is something to teach us today. Right?

John McLarty: So people that are just think about it, that are saved, truly saved, but they’ve fallen back under thinking they need to keep work, their works at a certain status. That fearfulness they have.

Kimberly Faith: Lose their peace. Lose peace. Here’s the thing.

John McLarty: That’s this falling from grace.

Kimberly Faith: I just wanna kind of take be the devil’s advocate here just for a minute, because I think that it’s easy for us to sit here and talk about they do this. They you know, people, meaning not us. But I’m just gonna say that I have fallen into this trap before. Not that I I was gonna lose my salvation, but becoming more trying to justify my behavior by giving God good works instead of giving him my heart. You know?

So you can see, because sometimes it’s just easier. You know, if we don’t have to surrender our heart, then we can hang on to our little pet sins, right? Like maybe we’re slothful in prayer or something like And well, if I’m doing this and doing that and doing this, not doing these big sins, then God’s gonna wink wink at my slothfulness and prayer. So this idea of substituting works for a surrendered heart. You mentioned earlier that we have a constant need to repent, right?

And as Christians, as born against believers, not for salvation, but for a prosperous life in earning those crowns we’ve talked about, right?

John McLarty: Yeah, that is a good point too. That’s falling from grace kind of in a different way, but falling from, you know, just the grace of serving God because we love him.

Kimberly Faith: Right.

John McLarty: So we get into this kind of substitute. Well, I’m not gonna be totally surrendered to God, but I’m gonna do these good works. I’m gonna give to the poor. I’m gonna

Kimberly Faith: go, you know. We drift into legalism.

John McLarty: Right.

Kimberly Faith: Yeah. Which is which is what I think he was talking about. You’re estranged from Christ is really this drift into legalism, doesn’t mean you lost your salvation. You haven’t lost your eternal standing. You’re just losing your experience of the presence of God here on earth and the rewards in the life to come, which is, again, this verse is completely talking to Christians about how they live.

John McLarty: And it kind of all fits in because you lose that motivation to serve God just because you love him.

Kimberly Faith: Yes.

John McLarty: Because you’re saved by grace and you get into this works and then you lose your true motivation. So that becomes kind of this, you know

Kimberly Faith: It’s a vicious Yeah.

John McLarty: A self fulfilling cycle.

Kimberly Faith: And it’s not self fulfilling. That’s the whole point. Your deepest self is your soul. Right? And when we start becoming mercenary, in other words, we’re doing these good works just so we can check the box and, you know, appease God or appease our conscience or maybe appease somebody else who might be watching us, say, well, they can see my good works, right?

John McLarty: Yeah, well, cycle is it builds on itself.

Kimberly Faith: That’s right.

John McLarty: So it’s this downward spiral. Absolutely. And all of sudden you’re serving God totally out of just, you know- Selfish reasons. Selfish reasons.

Kimberly Faith: Yeah, and it’s completely dissatisfying. And that’s, I’ll tell you, that’s why I fell away the first time I was, you know, after I was saved, because I got caught into that, basically the Judaizing cycle of legalism, like, well, I’m just gonna do these things because people are watching me and I don’t wanna be bothered by questions. And that’s so unsatisfying. It’s kind of like, you know, a person who is a human going to wallow in pig pen. You’re never going to be happy in the pig pen because you weren’t born to live in the pig pen.

John McLarty: Well, it’s so interesting, and we can’t chase this rabbit fully, but if we lose then that in the judgment seat of Christ, when we’re being judged for our works, it’s not our works per se. And since you’ve fed so many homeless and you helped so many ladies across the street, it’s all about your motivation. Yes. Burns. Your heart to do it.

That’s right. Yeah. Or your works. You can have these works that are just burned up because you did them to keep your salvation.

Kimberly Faith: Right, right. Well, let’s kinda move on to the fourth scripture, which is Matthew seven twenty one-twenty three. You wanna read that?

John McLarty: Yeah, this is, boy, this packs a punch here. Not everyone who says to me, Lord, Lord shall enter into the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name, cast out demons in your name and done many wonders in your name? And then I will declare to them, I never knew you, depart from me, ye who practice lawlessness.

Kimberly Faith: Yeah, and I think the King James says, You who do inequity, which is a little stronger. So who’s Jesus talking to?

John McLarty: Well, saying we get into true salvation and eternal security, he said, I never knew you. He didn’t say, I knew you as a born again child and rejected you. I never knew you. So these people were never saved. Yeah.

They didn’t have salvation and lose it. Is of Sermon on the Mount.

Kimberly Faith: Yeah. You know, so he’s talking to, you know, it’s funny. I was actually, you know, I actually went to the place in Israel where they believe the Sermon on the Mount was preached. And, you know, I I kind of read through this because it was like, I’m trying to imagine what it was like, you know? Mhmm.

And I’m I can see that, of course, there was a synagogue there and everything. And, you know, I’m trying to imagine these Jewish leaders sitting here listening to this. And because, you know, we we know that there were a lot of religious Jews in the area that weren’t listening to the Sermon on the Mount. I mean, I’m sure there were because and wait. So he’s talking to people who have trusted in external righteousness and religious works.

I use and what’s amazing about this is that he says, we’ve cast out demons in your name. We’ve done many wonders in your name. That just to me, I mean, a lot of religious organizations today equate, this must be God because we’re healing people. This must be God because we’re doing these wonderful works, but they’re preaching the gospel based on works like the Jews were, the Jews of the first century, the religious leaders, I should say. And Jesus is just saying, look, aren’t even I have never known you.

So this doesn’t mean you can lose your salvation, you know, because you were doing all these things that are in his name. A lot of things are done in the name I of mean, wars are fought in the name of God. You know, people are slaughtered in the name of God.

John McLarty: And people that aren’t true Christians, there is a spiritual warfare. Yes. And Satan can he’s the master of manipulation.

Kimberly Faith: Right.

John McLarty: There can actually be demons cast out and spells cast. Right.

Kimberly Faith: Oh, yeah.

John McLarty: In a total non Christian environment.

Kimberly Faith: Well, yeah.

John McLarty: Just, you know, whose demon is, you know, the more powerful demon?

Kimberly Faith: Well, and we’ve we’ve seen that in in both the old testament and new testament. Plenty of examples of people who are diviners, people who, you they know, were into the were they were empowered by the evil forces to do things that were miraculous. Mean, even when we talk about the when Moses went to Pharaoh to say, let my people go. Well, the magicians made a stick turn into a Right,

John McLarty: right. Supernatural powers.

Kimberly Faith: Right, right. I mean, Satan’s all without power because he is a spirit. He’s a dead spirit, but he’s a spirit. And so here Jesus is talking about, you know, talking to people who were never born again. And, and so he’s I think he’s I mean, to me, he’s driving home to the point that the tragedy here is that don’t be self deceived into thinking you belong to me if you’ve never come to me and receive my the gift of salvation by grace through faith and relying on your own works.

In other words, this is not rejection of a born again convert. It’s a rejection of someone who’s never been saved.

John McLarty: Exactly. So, yeah. And true salvation is just accepting Jesus as our savior.

Kimberly Faith: That’s right. That’s right.

John McLarty: Under conviction of the Holy Spirit and repentance and faith, believing in him. So it is a real thing, but it’s not substituted or replaced by this life of works.

Kimberly Faith: That’s right.

John McLarty: It’s called by grace.

Kimberly Faith: Let’s just kinda wrap up by talking about last verse, which is Revelations three:five. It says, He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments. I will not blot his name from the book of life, but I will confess his name before my father and before his angels. So who is Jesus talking about here?

John McLarty: Well, this is Revelations. He’s addressing a church, the church of Sardis, and a congregation that had a reputation for outward spiritual vitality, but was kind of considered dead in spiritual complacency. Right.

Kimberly Faith: So when we talk about blot his name from the book of life, I kind of wonder if we’re I don’t think this is implying that true believers names could ever be removed, but the phrase I will not blot out underscores the certainty kind of by negating the opposite.

John McLarty: That’s almost affirming the security.

Kimberly Faith: Yeah, yeah, exactly. And I think also, you know, I also think about, I don’t know if we’ve done a podcast on this, I know I’ve done a devotional on it, but the idea that children, when they’re born, before they reach the age of accountability, you know, I think about, well, names, are we know they don’t if they die before they’re old enough to commit moral sin, that unrighteousness is not imputed to But, you know, I kind of wonder if this scripture has any bearing on that.

John McLarty: I think it could. Yeah. I think

Kimberly Faith: it’s but we know that we I absolutely 100% know that this can’t be talking about God take Jesus taking people out of the, taking away their salvation because of all the things we’ve talked about, the seven reasons we can’t lose our salvation. So, you know, when when I’m interpreting hard scriptures in the Bible, one the one thing I always say is, why do we know this can’t mean X? You know, it can’t mean you have you’ll lose your salvation because we have these seven reasons that the Bible says we don’t lose our salvation. So it must mean mean something different. And I I don’t I think that it is a phrase that is affirming security.

John McLarty: Yeah. Actually affirms eternal

Kimberly Faith: security. Yeah. And not implying

John McLarty: true

Kimberly Faith: So

Jacob Paul: believers could ever be

Kimberly Faith: anyway, well, those are just five scriptures. There are probably some more we could talk about, but I think it’s good to kind of address the hard questions, which I appreciate you being willing to do with me today.

John McLarty: This has been really good. You know, it’s good just to look at the hard questions. You know, somebody might be all excited about eternal security and they get hit with different, and you some of these are, you know, a little clearer than others. I mean, to me, Galatians, the falling from grace, the context of that is so clear. So is Hebrews, not renewed to repentance.

Kimberly Faith: Well, I think the reason I

John McLarty: But it’s worth looking at them. The word of God doesn’t contradict itself.

Kimberly Faith: That’s right. And that’s why I wanted to look at the seven, kind of the seven reasons I think that we talked about first, why you do have, when you have salvation is forever. Because really these other verses are talking about either a false conversion or a loss of fellowship reward and fruitfulness for the the genuine believer. This is one or the other. Right?

The verse in the Sermon on the Mount was talking about people who never were saved. The other verses are more talking about a truly born again person who is losing fellowship, reward, basically the crowns and the eternal rewards we’ve talked about, right?

John McLarty: I think a good summary is that the Word of God leaves no room for doubt about whether God has secured the eternity of our soul after we’re born again. That’s a key. We’ve gotta be born again. Have that new creature.

Kimberly Faith: Absolutely. Yeah. The book of Romans says in 08/3839, for I am persuaded that neither death nor life nor angels nor principalities nor powers nor things present nor things to come nor height nor depth nor any created thing shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus, our Lord.

John McLarty: Amen to that. That’s That’s pretty

Kimberly Faith: pretty clear. I think that covers it, dad.

John McLarty: And all praise to God.

Kimberly Faith: That’s right. And I just would encourage you, if you’re listening to this podcast and you have never received Jesus Christ as your Lord and savior, like dad was talking about earlier, we are all in need of a savior. The Bible says all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. But Jesus died for every one of us. Every person on earth, he paid the entire penalty for when He came and He died and He rose again.

He conquered sin, He conquered death, and He made promise to us that if we receive Him, Jesus said, Whosoever believes on me shall not perish, but have everlasting life. If you have heard this gospel message have been God has sent you the gift of repentance, the gift of faith, that you can believe that, you can believe him, he can be trusted.

John McLarty: Amen.

Kimberly Faith: Then all you have to do is say, I do. Amen. I surrender and receive Jesus Christ as your Lord and savior, your life will never be the same.

John McLarty: Receive the gift of grace.

Kimberly Faith: That’s right. That’s right. And so if that’s you and you need, or you need to talk to somebody about that, shoot us an email. We have an email on our infogofaithstrong dot com. Reach out to us and, boy, there’s nothing greater.

There’s no greater miracle that happens in heaven or earth than when a lost person comes to know Jesus.

John McLarty: Amen. Well, it’s great to look into the word of God with you, Kim.

Jacob Paul: You’ve been listening to the truth and love podcast with your hosts, Kimberly Faith and John Mack. To discover more answers to the big questions in life, visit us at gofaithstrong.com.

Kimberly Faith: Rescued me.